Great stuff Alex,
Looking foward to going for a drive with you. Let me know if your planning a local run.
Good to have you back sporting a SOO081!
Smokey.
no longer subaru-less
bad news.
its all turned to poo!
due to unforseen financial circumstances, I couldn't take the subaru. With my impending trip overseas, It was a choice between my trip or the car...
unfortunately, the trip won.
so I went back to the dealer's, asking for my $500 deposit back...
he turned around, said no, and asked for a "10% cancellation fee" ($1200).
Funny thing is, I haven't signed a thing!!
Told him to stop pulling my leg, and to refund me of my deposit.
He refused, stating I had entered a "contract" (mind you, I DIDN'T SIGN A THING!!)
He told me that he'd see me in court, and that it would be cheaper to pay him!!
pfft. $30 to have my case heard...
so, I've complained to the Department of fair trading, and put foward my case with the small claims tribunal.
Not only Im refusing to pay him his supposed $1200 fee, Im going to demand my $500 back!!
anybody know where I stand with this? According to the Department of fair trading, after speaking to two seperate people, both claim that because I haven't signed any terms or conditions, The dealer cannot assume that he is entitled to a 10% fee (or any fee for that matter) and should refund me of my deposit!!
agree? disagree?
my latest subaru experience has indeed gone sour
its all turned to poo!
due to unforseen financial circumstances, I couldn't take the subaru. With my impending trip overseas, It was a choice between my trip or the car...
unfortunately, the trip won.
so I went back to the dealer's, asking for my $500 deposit back...
he turned around, said no, and asked for a "10% cancellation fee" ($1200).
Funny thing is, I haven't signed a thing!!
Told him to stop pulling my leg, and to refund me of my deposit.
He refused, stating I had entered a "contract" (mind you, I DIDN'T SIGN A THING!!)
He told me that he'd see me in court, and that it would be cheaper to pay him!!
pfft. $30 to have my case heard...
so, I've complained to the Department of fair trading, and put foward my case with the small claims tribunal.
Not only Im refusing to pay him his supposed $1200 fee, Im going to demand my $500 back!!
anybody know where I stand with this? According to the Department of fair trading, after speaking to two seperate people, both claim that because I haven't signed any terms or conditions, The dealer cannot assume that he is entitled to a 10% fee (or any fee for that matter) and should refund me of my deposit!!
agree? disagree?
my latest subaru experience has indeed gone sour
1998 Subaru Legacy GTB
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steptoe
- Master Member
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- Joined: Thu Oct 06, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: 14 miles outside Gotham City
sort of a gentlemans agreement of longstanding
you lose, but sh1t this is modern day business, no contract signed but did they give you a receipt, coz you'll need that to prove something at least
and you can give the kind sirs some free advertising here if you wish to tell us who you were going to buy car off
you lose, but sh1t this is modern day business, no contract signed but did they give you a receipt, coz you'll need that to prove something at least
and you can give the kind sirs some free advertising here if you wish to tell us who you were going to buy car off
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Brad
- Junior Member
- Posts: 53
- Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 10:00 am
- Location: Brisbane, Queensland
- Contact:
mmm
you will have issues even though you didn't sign anything.
A contract does not have to be written it can be verbal or otherwise.
If you agreed on a price and a deposit was paid and you have no reason to default ie nothing wrong with car hint hint hint then you most likley get your $$$ back.
By giving the deposit you have entered into a binding contract.
I suggest you simply get the car inspected by the NRMA or similiar, if they find anything wrong with it then you can walk and get you $$$ back.
They will always find something wrong.
Hope that helps
A contract does not have to be written it can be verbal or otherwise.
If you agreed on a price and a deposit was paid and you have no reason to default ie nothing wrong with car hint hint hint then you most likley get your $$$ back.
By giving the deposit you have entered into a binding contract.
I suggest you simply get the car inspected by the NRMA or similiar, if they find anything wrong with it then you can walk and get you $$$ back.
They will always find something wrong.
Hope that helps
I'm in no way qualified in legal matters and my info is from an experience my uncle went through a few years back.
He agreed to sell his vehicle to a chap, who then was uncontactable for three months (no deposit taken). As my uncle could not get a hold of him, he sold the car to another guy. Original chap turned up (three months later, mind you) and insisted on getting the car. He then took my uncle to court and sued him for the difference in price between the agreed price for my uncles car and another similar model the guy ended up buying.
These were two year old Jaguars, and the difference was $10500. needless to say my uncle was pissed, and it all came down to the judge agreeing they had a "Gentleman's agreement" (some gentleman!).
That said, if the dealer still has your deposit, he cannot sell the car to another until the matter is finalised. I would keep an eye on the yard and see if he still has the car on the lot with the sale documents in the widow. If he sells it whilst still holding your deposit, you could sue him. You could even say you had re-changed your mind and intended to buy it and maybe sue him for full amount.
I suggest you get professional legal advise rather than listening to me, though. Alot of places will give you a free first visit and give you general guidance if you are only trying to find out if you have a good case.
Good luck with it all. Dealers like this give the rest a bad name. No wonder they are viewed as the lowest of the low life.
Keep us posted - interested to see how it pans out for you.
He agreed to sell his vehicle to a chap, who then was uncontactable for three months (no deposit taken). As my uncle could not get a hold of him, he sold the car to another guy. Original chap turned up (three months later, mind you) and insisted on getting the car. He then took my uncle to court and sued him for the difference in price between the agreed price for my uncles car and another similar model the guy ended up buying.
These were two year old Jaguars, and the difference was $10500. needless to say my uncle was pissed, and it all came down to the judge agreeing they had a "Gentleman's agreement" (some gentleman!).
That said, if the dealer still has your deposit, he cannot sell the car to another until the matter is finalised. I would keep an eye on the yard and see if he still has the car on the lot with the sale documents in the widow. If he sells it whilst still holding your deposit, you could sue him. You could even say you had re-changed your mind and intended to buy it and maybe sue him for full amount.
I suggest you get professional legal advise rather than listening to me, though. Alot of places will give you a free first visit and give you general guidance if you are only trying to find out if you have a good case.
Good luck with it all. Dealers like this give the rest a bad name. No wonder they are viewed as the lowest of the low life.
Keep us posted - interested to see how it pans out for you.
Willie.
Canberra
MY06 Forester XT Luxury
MY05 Pajero Exceed DiD
1975 VW L Bug (1303)
Canberra
MY06 Forester XT Luxury
MY05 Pajero Exceed DiD
1975 VW L Bug (1303)
Yeah I think you may not see that $500 again. A contract doesn't have to be a peice of paper.
At the end of the day, whats the deposit for? It's protection for the dealer so they don't get dicked around by people changing their minds (or cancelling for other reasons). It may not have actaully cost the dealer any money to hold the car for that short amount of time for you, but there's equal chance it might have. They might have missed out on selling it to somebody else in the mean time for instance.
By definition a deposit is a sum of money given as security.
Dispite your unfortunate change in financial circumstances I think loosing the $500 deposit is fair.
However... the dealer turning around and trying to charge a cancellation fee aswell is over the top! 8O
At the end of the day, whats the deposit for? It's protection for the dealer so they don't get dicked around by people changing their minds (or cancelling for other reasons). It may not have actaully cost the dealer any money to hold the car for that short amount of time for you, but there's equal chance it might have. They might have missed out on selling it to somebody else in the mean time for instance.
By definition a deposit is a sum of money given as security.
Dispite your unfortunate change in financial circumstances I think loosing the $500 deposit is fair.
However... the dealer turning around and trying to charge a cancellation fee aswell is over the top! 8O
I think you will have lost the $500. You didnt mention if you got a reciept. If you didnt get a receipt then you are definately not going to see the money but it clears you from him trying to get a 10% deposit as you cant prove you gave him money and he cant prove you entered into a verbal/monetary contract.
If you got a reciept but did not sign any contracts he will be hard pressed to get any more than the deposit as you did not enter an agreement informing you that you would forfeit 10% of the purchase price.
Either way I would be surprised if the Dept Fair Trading would suggest that you are entitled to the $500 back as lawfully he is entitled to it. And if he didnt give you a reciept then he is dodgy. And from what you said sounds like there is no way he is going to be nice and give you the money back out of kindness..
The only way I can see you possibly getting the money back is if you got a receipt and as Brad said there is an undisclosed fault with the vehicle that would negate a contract
If you got a reciept but did not sign any contracts he will be hard pressed to get any more than the deposit as you did not enter an agreement informing you that you would forfeit 10% of the purchase price.
Either way I would be surprised if the Dept Fair Trading would suggest that you are entitled to the $500 back as lawfully he is entitled to it. And if he didnt give you a reciept then he is dodgy. And from what you said sounds like there is no way he is going to be nice and give you the money back out of kindness..
The only way I can see you possibly getting the money back is if you got a receipt and as Brad said there is an undisclosed fault with the vehicle that would negate a contract
Dougz....
84 Brumby - (Project rally car, one day)
89 Brumby
86 Touring Wagon - (with aftermarket turbo)
2004 BA Falcon Ute
2005 VZ SV6 Commodore.
84 Brumby - (Project rally car, one day)
89 Brumby
86 Touring Wagon - (with aftermarket turbo)
2004 BA Falcon Ute
2005 VZ SV6 Commodore.
thanks for the advice guys.
i also feel the $500 will go. i'm prepared to let it go, but the $1200 is well over the mark of being reasonable.
still, I'll push for the $500 back, as nothing was mentioned about the deposit being refundable or not, and as I did not sight nor sign any terms or contracts.
I'm quite confident that the car will go. Im not going to dick around with this dealer... may be stirring up an ant's nest. Apparently also, what I was entitled to do was to contact the bank, and cancel the transaction that was made with the $500 deposit (it was done on my VISA savings card), thus having the bank physically withdraw my $500 back to me from him.
I decided against doing that, I didn't want him to sue me for that money.
So, with this NRMA inspection, if the car fails the inspection, this is enough to break the contract? Or does the inspection need to be negotiated with the deal (ie too late now)? Sure he's turned around and pulled a swifty on me, I guess it wouldn't be seen by the CTTT (conciliation hearing) as a positive thing that I had now turned around and pulled a swifty on me?
thanks for your comments and advice. will definately keep you all posted of progress.
alex
i also feel the $500 will go. i'm prepared to let it go, but the $1200 is well over the mark of being reasonable.
still, I'll push for the $500 back, as nothing was mentioned about the deposit being refundable or not, and as I did not sight nor sign any terms or contracts.
I'm quite confident that the car will go. Im not going to dick around with this dealer... may be stirring up an ant's nest. Apparently also, what I was entitled to do was to contact the bank, and cancel the transaction that was made with the $500 deposit (it was done on my VISA savings card), thus having the bank physically withdraw my $500 back to me from him.
I decided against doing that, I didn't want him to sue me for that money.
So, with this NRMA inspection, if the car fails the inspection, this is enough to break the contract? Or does the inspection need to be negotiated with the deal (ie too late now)? Sure he's turned around and pulled a swifty on me, I guess it wouldn't be seen by the CTTT (conciliation hearing) as a positive thing that I had now turned around and pulled a swifty on me?
thanks for your comments and advice. will definately keep you all posted of progress.
alex
1998 Subaru Legacy GTB
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Lapsed
- Junior Member
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- Location: Seville Grove, WA
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I have to agree with willie. My folks and litttle sister went through some thing similar. They put down and signed a contract, stating they had to buy the car if they put a deposit on it. but is supose you can get away with it because the bloke didn't say anything about a cancelation fee in your verbal contract.
Or you could make him hold onto the car till you return from your holiday!! as willie said he can't sell it, if he does they you make nearly 13000 from him(maybe)
But this is my opinion. seek leagal advise would be the best thing
chris
Or you could make him hold onto the car till you return from your holiday!! as willie said he can't sell it, if he does they you make nearly 13000 from him(maybe)
But this is my opinion. seek leagal advise would be the best thing
chris
-
Brad
- Junior Member
- Posts: 53
- Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 10:00 am
- Location: Brisbane, Queensland
- Contact:
mmm
What I would do :smoov wrote:thanks for the advice guys.
Apparently also, what I was entitled to do was to contact the bank, and cancel the transaction that was made with the $500 deposit (it was done on my VISA savings card), thus having the bank physically withdraw my $500 back to me from him.
I decided against doing that, I didn't want him to sue me for that money.
So, with this NRMA inspection, if the car fails the inspection, this is enough to break the contract? Or does the inspection need to be negotiated with the deal (ie too late now)? Sure he's turned around and pulled a swifty on me, I guess it wouldn't be seen by the CTTT (conciliation hearing) as a positive thing that I had now turned around and pulled a swifty on me?
thanks for your comments and advice. will definately keep you all posted of progress.
alex
Ring the dealer and tell him you want an independant inspection done by the NRMA on the vehicle. This will cost around $120 mark. They will do the inspection and find some things wrond, old, worn, dinted, scratched etc etc . Once you have the report which he can not have a copy of unless you give it to him, simply ring him up and say that you no longer want the car as a result of the inspection. He then has to give you your money back. If he doesn't then you simply ring the bank and cancell the transaction based on the report.
Then you have $380 back in your pocket.
That being said I don't think you should get your $500 back as a deposit is a deposit. It is given as an act of good faith that you will follow through on the deal which you gave your word on. Just because you changed your mind doesn't mean he should be out of pocket as a result.
I mean if you went back to buy the car and it was sold then you would be going the other way of saying "But I paid a deposit he can't sell it " So why should you just be able to change your mind and expect him to roll over and give your money back ??
Just my opinion ..
Brad:
Thanks for your opinion. It always is good to hear from an outsider, as they may have the best view upon the situation.
The way i see it is like this: according to the department of fair trading, he's not entitled to a single cent, because he has not prepared the paperwork for me to sign.
I like the idea of the NRMA inspection... but i'm not sure if he still has the car. Really, all I have done is given him $500, with no legally binding contract. So, he may have sold the car already. Although I don't really want to see his scumsucking, thieving, fiendish face again, I should check it out.
Would it really be worth my investing for an additional $120 for an NRMA inspection a week or so later after filing a complaint with the department of fair trading?
And what would he be out of pocket for??
many thanks
alex
Thanks for your opinion. It always is good to hear from an outsider, as they may have the best view upon the situation.
The way i see it is like this: according to the department of fair trading, he's not entitled to a single cent, because he has not prepared the paperwork for me to sign.
I like the idea of the NRMA inspection... but i'm not sure if he still has the car. Really, all I have done is given him $500, with no legally binding contract. So, he may have sold the car already. Although I don't really want to see his scumsucking, thieving, fiendish face again, I should check it out.
Would it really be worth my investing for an additional $120 for an NRMA inspection a week or so later after filing a complaint with the department of fair trading?
And what would he be out of pocket for??
many thanks
alex
1998 Subaru Legacy GTB