Subaru Winch

Jerrad · Post by **Jerrad** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:15 pm

So why is it that there are people modifying snorkels and stuff but none putting a winch on?
I have looked at a few different things...

I see these as a problem...
http://www.bushwinch.com.au/index.html

I like the top one, It doesnt seem to hang out the back as much. But is it safe and worth it? I have seen a few cars, 1 was an Outback that had a Haymon Reese on the front for moving boats around.
http://www.dnaoffroad.com.au/products.p ... nch-cradle
http://orbitalfab.com.au/winch.html

Is there a reason for no one having put one on the front like big 4WDs?
What does other people use?

JPM · Post by **JPM** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 9:39 pm

In my "one day" plans I'm hoping to fit a winch on a custom front bumper bar, and I know a few of the regulars on here have successfully fitted winch's in a few different configurations (D-Generate ect).

Having looked at the links above though, I've got to say I'm fascinated by the Bush Winch, and am pretty keen to look into it further. To my way of thinking and considering the type of offroad driving I want to do, they look very good, albeit a bit pricey. The reviews I read about them, and the fact they fit with limited mods makes them appealing.

What's your reservation with it? Why do you see them as a problem? Anybody else got an opinion?

Jayd

D3V1L · Post by **D3V1L** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:03 pm

the bush winch, or wheel winch is a waste of money time and effort, and cant discourage enough. we sold them for a while and they where nothing but a pure disaster

davo

JPM · Post by **JPM** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:13 pm

D3V1L wrote:the bush winch, or wheel winch is a waste of money time and effort, and cant discourage enough. we sold them for a while and they where nothing but a pure disaster

davo

Why? Don't work? Too hard to use?

As I say, from only reading through the link I kinda really thought they were he best thing since sliced bread.

I want a winch, but I'd want a replacement custom made metal front bumper to fit it to, else I think I'd rip it off. At the moment there is stuff all to mount it to on the mighty Impreza.

Jayd

MTB92 · Post by **MTB92** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:31 pm

on most subies, or any without a serious lsd or locker, that would just spin the other wheel if you were really stuck. it would only work on cars with locking diffs of some sort.

it could i guess be used to stop a wheel in the air spinning, but other than that i dont really see the point.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:37 pm

MTB92 wrote:on most subies, or any without a serious lsd or locker, that would just spin the other wheel if you were really stuck. it would only work on cars with locking diffs of some sort.

Plus I dont think its legal to have something sticking way out like that.

A nice idea but just wouldnt work!

RSR 555 · Post by **RSR 555** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:38 pm

Looking at that wheel winch, I'd say it would be awful to use. IMO it looks like it would try and pull the car out sideways

I like the idea of replacing the rear hitch but you'd want to make sure you towbar is strong enough to pull your vehicle from a sticky spot.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Sun Mar 25, 2012 11:32 pm

I saw a similar set up to that bushwinch back in about 1975 up in Port Hedland, I was at a servo and an old guy in an early 60's American tank pulled in with a drum similar to these attached to his back wheels, they stuck out about 10" and he swore by it & I've actually been thinking about them lately and how to design it and here they are, personally I'd only have the drum about 4" diameter like the old guy had.

rtcb65 · Post by **rtcb65** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:27 am

Jerrad wrote:So why is it that there are people modifying snorkels and stuff but none putting a winch on?
I have looked at a few different things...

I see these as a problem...
http://www.bushwinch.com.au/index.html

I like the top one, It doesnt seem to hang out the back as much. But is it safe and worth it? I have seen a few cars, 1 was an Outback that had a Haymon Reese on the front for moving boats around.
http://www.dnaoffroad.com.au/products.p ... nch-cradle
http://orbitalfab.com.au/winch.html

Is there a reason for no one having put one on the front like big 4WDs?
What does other people use?

I dont know what you mean by saying . no one is fitting winches to there cars. We had done two. showthread.php?t=12696&page=49

purp · Post by **purp** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:37 am

I've got a small winch on my "L". Came on a bullbar from a parts car. My "one day" list definitely includes a custom bar and more powerful winch. The reason though that people don't do it a lot (apart from lack of space) is that without big chunky sold chassis rails to bolt to, you are always going to be at risk of winching the bar clean off....

Recent tread with pics of mine

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:42 am

Here's the other thing, that hub winch, while someone's mentioned the lockers thing - use two, one on each side!

But my main point is that the photo on the website banner wouldn't work, they need a shackle on the bull bar or somewhere forward of the front wheels so that the rope/wire/chain? tracks onto the hub and not try to ride over the edge leaving the hub winch useless.

Plus you'd want to get your anchor point as head on as possible if winching from the back like that to begin with...

My 5c

Cheers

Bennie

taza · Post by **taza** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:33 pm

I'd be inclided to use the towbar and have some kind of adapter plate that mounts to the hitch reciever.

If we snatch from there then we could winch from there, of course only to recover ourselves. Not try and pull out a 3 tonne Landcruiser from mud or sand.

Snatching would put more strain and load on a tow bar than winching right?

purp · Post by **purp** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 1:47 pm

taza wrote:Snatching would put more strain and load on a tow bar than winching right?

Yes and no. The physics are rather complicated.

When you snatch, your put a very strong force on the attachment for a quite short amount of time. Just how short is dependant on several factors, like the weighs of the vehicles, the speed of the one "snatching", the elasticity of the strap, and whether the stuck car comes un-stuck. The attachment point will be fine most of the time (elastically deforming) then returning to its original shape. Unless you put just a little too much force on it, then it will often fail spectacularly. I think I heard mention in another thread that you might have experience with that taza?

On the other hand, winching should be much more controlled, slower application of force. But it can be on the car for a much longer period of time, so steel have time to beeennnnndddd (plasticly deforming) into a nice new shape.

Theoretically, the amount of energy to pull a car from a bog will be the same whatever method used, but my theoretical calculations are only good for perfect spherical subarus in frictionless environments.

taza · Post by **taza** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 4:09 pm

purp wrote:Yes and no. The physics are rather complicated.

When you snatch, your put a very strong force on the attachment for a quite short amount of time. Just how short is dependant on several factors, like the weighs of the vehicles, the speed of the one "snatching", the elasticity of the strap, and whether the stuck car comes un-stuck. The attachment point will be fine most of the time (elastically deforming) then returning to its original shape. Unless you put just a little too much force on it, then it will often fail spectacularly. I think I heard mention in another thread that you might have experience with that taza?

On the other hand, winching should be much more controlled, slower application of force. But it can be on the car for a much longer period of time, so steel have time to beeennnnndddd (plasticly deforming) into a nice new shape.

Theoretically, the amount of energy to pull a car from a bog will be the same whatever method used, but my theoretical calculations are only good for perfect spherical subarus in frictionless environments.

I see what you mean. 95% of the time a light to medium snatch is suffficient to get a subaru unstuck. More so where a winch would be handy is when your stuck on rocks, in sand and mud Maxtrax, pushing/digging or a small snatch get you out.

Yes I did do some damage to my Foz early last year. I only used one of the front tow points whch ripped the chassis area around where its attached. I have since then fixed it and use a distribution strap to spread the load between the two. The rear of the car is fine and what I try to use most of the time as its stronger from the towbar.

NachaLuva · Post by **NachaLuva** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:53 pm

What do others think of reinforcing the rials that the tie down points attach to. You could remove them then weld in sections of plate along that section of the chassis rail, then the points will have a much stronger base to bolt to...

Jerrad · Post by **Jerrad** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:19 pm

I thought more people would be doing a "larger stronger heavy duty" bar to go behind the bumper or something? Exactly like-
showthread.php?t=12696&page=49
I would have thought there would HAVE to be a work around, just might be costy, lol.
The Brumby on my trip made me actually wonder how it could be done.

B00sting · Post by **B00sting** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:58 pm

I plan to do it one day, but its behind the ej25 and lockers in priority!

Until then I always have the tirfor (hand winch), but damn its hard work.

On a side note i'd be interested in seeing more pictures of that brumby on your big river trip, I was up there today actually

purp · Post by **purp** » Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:47 pm

nachaluva wrote:What do others think of reinforcing the rials that the tie down points attach to. You could remove them then weld in sections of plate along that section of the chassis rail, then the points will have a much stronger base to bolt to...

This is what is in my head for my "one day" plans. Try and back up the mountings at each point from the winch back to as many points on the front of he car as possible.

Of course then you have to deal with the old strength/weight tradeoff... Winches are getting lighter though, with synthetic ropes. I like the idea of steel mountings to the winch, and a alloy bumper replacement bar over the top (which I think is what the bybs did for one of theirs?).