Advice - Subaru for some sand work

akpv · Post by **akpv** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:30 pm

Hi all,

I have recently moved to Perth and looking to get something setup to get me around this state of sand. Have spent a few weekends down south already and really keen to get into some spots that require 4wd to access due to sand.

Any advice on which way to go? Cheap is always good so thinking about hunting down a tidy gen 1 wagon and sorting out an outback strut lift. From the reading I have done springs and struts should give me around 2" of lift. Is this amount of lift appropriate for sand work / not getting beached? I figure I should be able to get a G1S2 wagon over here for ~$2000 + around $1000 to lift it. How do the stock (open?) diffs handle the sand? Would I need to look at upgrading wheels and tyres too or would the stockies be fine?

Another option is to find an outback or foz, looking around there aren't a huge number available for sale over here in WA. Would cost a little more but I would end up in a newer car.

My requirements at the moment are must have aircon, must be a wagon. My budget isn't strict at the moment but the cheaper the better as long as it is still functional.

Also anyone got any recommendations for where to look for second hand cars in Perth? Have been keeping an eye on gumtree, carsales and ebay so far.

guyph_01 · Post by **guyph_01** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:56 pm

If you want to go with the gen1 Liberty check this link out. Those are my mates car that i've pretty much built for them with some of their help lol

showthread.php?t=21377&highlight=damien

For the forester talk to taza:)

taza · Post by **taza** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:11 pm

G'day mate.

Alot of the guys here have L-series and Brumby's. Both great cars (I own an L-series) and I also have a 01 Forester. I have a mate with an Outback too.

One benefit to the newer Subies (97-03ish and onwards) compared to some of the older cars is you get alot more features, electric everything, reliablility and the best is comfort.

You have the choice of auto or manual and turbo or non turbo.

All subies do excellent in the sand due to them weighing so little. Carsale.com, carsguide and gumtree are good places for cars. The only bad choice is turbo and manual as you have no low range. With manuals and non turbos (like my forester) you get a low range gearbox which is extremely helpful offroad.
If your chasing a late 90's or early 2000 Foz or Outback you can get one for $4000-7000.

I also have 2" lift in mine with some slightly bigger all terrain tyres. I did it as when I lived in Geraldton (400km north of perth) I was on the beach and dunes almost everyday for nearly 2years. I found it made a HUGE difference, especially when you start to dig down or are in deep tracks or ruts. Just means you don't bottom out as quickly and since the lift I find I almost never get stuck so I would recommend 2". Tyres you could stay with highway tyres or some all terrains.
The open diffs do fine and so does the AWD, its really only on uneven surfaces where the open diffs are an issue but if you pic your line and have some speed you will be right. I wouldn't worry about that but you can custom built gearboxes with better low range gearing, lsd's, diff ratios, etc... some of us are doing this. Guy (above who posted), myself and a few others.

Feel free to ask any questions mate.

Taza

JPM · Post by **JPM** » Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:32 pm

Bah- don't listen to those guys

The best Subaru for 'sand work' is clearly a lifted Impreza (looks to D-Gen for back up)!!

Yes, I may be biased, but thats my 2 cents...

In all seriousness, no matter what you end up choosing, so long as it has a Six Star badge on the front, will make you smile. But make sure you go for the newest, cleanest example you can find. There are some real bargains to be had out there if you don't mind twirling the spanners- look at pickles.com.au to see what I mean.

Good luck with whatever you end up with!

Jayd

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:24 am

Yup, nothing wrong with Impreza's, nothing like seeing a car where it shouldn't be, like sitting on it's bash plate next to the ocean

.

G1 S1or2 or Gen 2GX would be fine with a lift but make sure you find a dual range one, I guess the 4" shorter wheel base of the Imp or Foz helps a bit.

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:35 am

if budget isnt an issue i would go a new subi say a forester or impreza, both will be more comfortable them the older liberty.
i personally would love to have a lifted impreza, while owning to foresters now and an older brumby, for an everyday car the forester's are alot more comfy!

vincentvega · Post by **vincentvega** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:14 pm

If its just a sand car then grab a gen1 / gen2 GX automatic.

cheap, reliable and very capable on the sand.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:21 pm

^ perfect with a good tranny cooler.

akpv · Post by **akpv** » Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:46 pm

Thanks for all the suggestions so far.

No one seems to have mentioned the outbacks, I understand they have a slightly longer wheelbase and more overhang at either end. Does this make much of a difference to it's capabilities? I gather the Gen2 outbacks had the head gasket problem, and I have read on here some problems with lifting the gen 3 outbacks. Is it really that much harder?

indy · Post by **indy** » Sun Apr 15, 2012 1:22 pm

Also interested to hear about the outback and its offroading capabilities!

Davidov · Post by **Davidov** » Sun Apr 15, 2012 1:22 pm

I live in Perth too.
My Gen 3 Outback (2003) Is kitted up with 3" of strut lift big A/T Tires Subaextreme Front bar subaextreme sump guard pretty much the works. It will beat almost every subi you will see offroad (given the driver with enough skill for it). It is up there with some of the most capable offroader subis in Perth.

Then it is a brilliant road car with all the height still handles well drives very smoothly. The Outback really will go perfectly fine in sand, however a subaextreme bullbar is almost a neccesity otherwise expect to lose the front bumper.
The Outback is a lot roomier than a Forester or deffinately an Impreza.
Only downside with the OB is the turning circle, but its livable (Mine is slightly worse because tires rub on full lock).

To put the 2" lift blocks in was an absolute mongrel, It would be easier to get lift blocks put in the same time as raised springs by a mechanic, for very little extra cost.

I was actually thinking of selling my car all kitted up as it is, however the price i would want ($16000, has over $20000 all up worth on car+mods) is too much for most as most dont want a car like mine anyway.

The late Gen 3 (Mine) has no issues with head gaskets.

taza · Post by **taza** » Sun Apr 15, 2012 1:28 pm

akpv wrote:Thanks for all the suggestions so far.

No one seems to have mentioned the outbacks, I understand they have a slightly longer wheelbase and more overhang at either end. Does this make much of a difference to it's capabilities? I gather the Gen2 outbacks had the head gasket problem, and I have read on here some problems with lifting the gen 3 outbacks. Is it really that much harder?

indy wrote:Also interested to hear about the outback and its offroading capabilities!

My mate has a gen 3 Outback (99-03 but his is 2003) with the 2.5l engine and dual range manual. It has 4.5" (strut and tyres no body lift), about 340mm at its lowest point in clearance, 29" all terrain tyres, Subxatreme front bar (help dramatically with the approach and departure angle on the Outback) and a few othe bit and pieces. For the most part it goes really well. The clearance and tyres make the biggest difference though.
The 2.5l with those tyres goes alright, not lightening quick but good enough.

With an OB you really need 2+ inch of lift due to the hang overs and the longer wheel base but its well worth it.

Nothing wrong with the OB its just a bigger car than a Forester with much more rear leg room and a bit bigger boot.

Taza

EDIT: Thats the OB im talking about above.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:53 am

Impreza & Forester = Identical floor pan.....Liberty & Outback = Identical floor pan but 4" longer, just the height & bumpers make them different off road.

Taza, if you want your car to go a little better and more economically there are a set of 01 GT 16" alloys for sale, way lighter than steelies so less un-sprung weight to lug around, a mate of mine has them & I'm sure he'd take $180 for them with bald Geolanders.

Sorry to hijack. Corrie call/text 0401160168

akpv · Post by **akpv** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:55 am

Another question, how do the 2L foresters go? I imagine they are a little slugish on the road, is the 2L a limiting factor off-road?

Davidov · Post by **Davidov** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:03 am

akpv wrote:Another question, how do the 2L foresters go? I imagine they are a little slugish on the road, is the 2L a limiting factor off-road?

Its deffinately limiting, as most engines are. However i wouldn't go as far as to say its no good. Taza and me have been surprised again and again at what his little 2L can do. That being said though there have been a lot of situations where power was lacking, both on and offroad.

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:17 am

i own both a 2l and a 2.5l forester and i honestly dont find the 2l guytless at all. the 2l foz is a great option

wombataaron · Post by **wombataaron** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:55 am

My modified for beach work outback is for sale, featuring the mighty H6 powerplant and a low 134,000km, im only asking 10 grand for it, find my members journal if you want to see what ive done to it. Rego til December, just been serviced, new tyres etc etc
http://www.carsales.com.au/private/deta ... 0&__N=1246 1247 1252 1282 1216&silo=Stock&find=bpp73r|CarAll

I love my car but i want something bigger to travel around Australia and camp in *troopy cough cough*

Post by **Alex** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:42 am

i could potentially have my gen3 outback for sale soon it already has 2inch lifted suspension ontop of the normal outback height. It goes really really well in the sand, its capability blew me away actually.

itll be pretty cheap and is a good car (has a little bit of hail damage)

alex

taza · Post by **taza** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:17 am

The 2.0l as Davidov said is good for a 2.0l but in the Forester is its number 1 biggest floor. Its alright when your just driving around by yourself but as soon as you load it up and/or hook up a trailer its gutless as hell. The only positive is that I thrash the hell out of it everywhere and I still get insanely good fuel economy.

Offroad well in sand its most noticable the 2.0l doesn't have enough torque/power down low. With my bigger tyres aired down to 16psi is does good for the most part but the 2.5 certain goes much smoother and you don't have to thrash it to hold your revs or get going. For a 2.0l though it is good and is very suprising with some of the stuff its been able to do. But you can't get the gearbox I have in my Forester in the Outback. The Outback only has a 19% reduction low range in the manuals (all autos have no low range in subarus). I have a 45% low range which even with the 2.0l definately makes a huge improvement over an outback or lib.
Since my gearbox needs rebuilding though I will be putting in L-Series low range gearset which is 59% reduction from high-range. I am also fitting a supercharger to the 2.0l engine too just to give it abit more power..

Thunder also doesn't have big heavy tyres with stell rims on his Forester too which make a noticable difference also.

Wombats car is an awesome buy if you keen to fly over east for it!!

Alex why are you selling your OB? I thought you were going to get a Subie to mod for offroading again....

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:34 pm

taza made a good point the forester 2l is great untill you load it up. the lack of power is also why i am thinking of keeping the standard size rather then increase it