Subaru UEC 1 , Ellie 0

[steptoe]

New coil in and - no joy no change .
I know this thing has fuel pressure because the aftermarket reg , downstream of the std buried one , has a gauge which reads 40 psig when the pumps running .

who wants Disco to get some photo sharing skills ?

Adrian, don't suppose you kept the old module that you swapped out, thinking it may work now its had a rest and not hot ? Was thinking carbon holding valve open a bit, but all of them ? Wonder how caked up your EGR valve is - or was before the can-o-worms

[discopotato03]

Have my oracles compression test gauge but have to go get smashed at the Gym first .
Erm logic suggests that flat engines have their exhaust valves lower - so any partly digeated gunge should gravitate towards them , its Pauls suggestion of the lifters pumping up that could be a concern . How does one "bleed" them back down or inwards anyway .
Also the last partly working cylinder was no2 but now is zero .

Back later , cheers A .

[mud_king91]

try a spray mix of brake fluid and water... cheaper and just as effective as carby or tb cleaner

[pitrack_1]

You mentioned pulling off the vacuum hose to squirt the UEC stuff in. In the fiddling about I was just wondering is it possible that there is a loose/cracked/disconnected vacuum hose- a leaking vacuum hose (eg loose, cracked) getting progressively leakier would lean out the mixture until it stopped. It's an easy check to do, if you suspect a crack somewhere you can't see (underside of a hard to reach hose) perhaps checking the brake servo has maintained vacuum assistance a couple of minutes after ign off may be a way.

The dealer just ran UEC too through our Forester Diesel at the 50k kms service.

Good luck, I sincerely hope your valves aren't all charcoaled up, that would be a real party killer!

Oh, one other suggestion: could you perhaps have dud fuel? Just filled up at the servo, or run a fuel system cleaner through? Fuel filter may be worth a check.

[discopotato03]

Mine has the Spider Vortex manifold and all the original licorice hoses are long gone . Coxy and I went over everything I could have touched in the gunge process and nothing seems out of place .
My fuel gauge shows 3/4 tank and I always run it from full to virtually empty so contaminated fuel is unlikely . Its diet has for ages been BP 95 or 98 .
Not impossible the fuel filter is choked but I've changed it twice since I've had this car and opened them up to find nothing out of the ordinary .

Now the compression test , too tired yesterday so gave it a shot this afternoon . Bloody gauge doesn't hold pressure does it ...
Urm also the plugs come out looking brand new though they have a little unburnt fuel on them . Like I said this thing is making absolutely no attemp to fire - at all .
Anyhow I have to chase up anouther compression test gauge and I probably won't have any time to spend on this car till the weekend .

Its becoming a dangerous time for this car because every day I drive my two other ones they make Ellie less of a requirement . I am determined not to go back inside this EA82 if its serious dollars and if thats the only way then its all over . I hope it doesn't come to that because that brings forward the sell complete or part out issue .

Time will tell , A .

[steptoe]

sure to be a small thing causing this, just to really piddle you off when you find it, c'mon, hurry up ! a few of us are intrigued !

If only we were kind to NRMA .... I recall a service guy connected a box to a car because its ignition module was toast, think this box allowed car to run under its own steam to the workshop where NRMA took his box out and left.... I think...
poss question ... does the module need to be under the pickup to work ? Could any old two pin module be hooked up outside th dizzzy for some spark action to occur ?

[discopotato03]

Dunno bout that but Coxy did find that his compression test gauge had a dicky check valve - which he fixed .
I got him to test it in his Brumby and discovered it had more than just the fancy Magnetti Marelli coil and works Nissan CDI ignition running the lightening show .
Me remembering that Steptoe said something about NGK BCP plugs having the 5/8" hexagon noticed Coxy pulling out this fancy twin earth electrode NGK plug with BKR6EK on it . Hmm .
Anyway armed with a nice Bluepoint digital compression test kit I'm about to go see how much wind this ornery RX has in its lugs - er lungs ...
Righ after another smashing at the gym .

Those 5/8 hex plugs ARE more compact that the 13/16 giants as is the matching plug socket . Will invest in both if I can find what ails Ellies lump .

Back later , cheers A .

[discopotato03]

As mentioned in the 82 hate wall thread cranking compression is too low at 55 to 12.5 PSI .
Coxy reckons try another dose of SUEC and see if it spits the offending whatever out .
From looking in the factory WSM the valves in these heads angle up slightly from level so its possible that Subergunge has oozed down the valve stems turning
any carbon on the exposed valve stems into glue causing them to stick in their valve guides .

A .

[steptoe]

So, what are the proper instructions for using the UEC ? To avoid this drama ?
Might just disconnect EGR function .....as that is where all the sht comes from me thinks, that and PCV hoses....

[discopotato03]

I did exactly as directed by the instructions on the can .
I stress that I will NEVER again spray SUEC into an engine turning at less than 2500 to 3000 revs . At these revs I highly doubt anything would stick and any carbon etc would get spat out quick smart .
Coxy I believe has used this stuff before but never put it into an engine that wasn't running - at revs .

A .

[discopotato03]

Just off the phone to Paul at Subareck and the news isn't good .
It sounds like I have to pull the cam boxes off and try to free the valves up by tapping the valve stems to see if I can get the valves to close .
Sounds like more BS work with belt covers and belts and if it doesn't work the heads have to come off .

A .

[Brumby Kid]

What you need is to FORCE the engine to move.
Yes you could pull it apart.
But I still think if you where to tow or run it down a hill in gear,
Forcing the engine and valves to move tht it might do it.
Worth a shot, much better than pulling apart your engine.

Cheers Cam

[steptoe]

Sounds like the thoughts are that the UEC dissolved the scunge and before you were able to burn it all off and out the tail pipe it has evaporated, leaving the gunge to gum up bits that have never seen garbage before ie valve stems ...

what if you were to apply more UEC, sorry, find big hill, safely park at the top, then fill internals with UEC, give it some time to soften the suspected crud and varnishes, gums etc , IGN ON, strap on safety helmet and try a few clutch starts down the hill, saving starter motor or even just roll down in gear forcing everything to turn from rear wheels forward

[discopotato03]

The engine does turn but if the valves won't close I'm concerbed the rockers could unload and dislodge and if they get in the way of turning cam lobes and wedge against something solid ....
I'm searching elsewhere and so far people have said trying to free the valves up with penetrating oil can work - if they're jaming in their valve guides .
No I'm going to have to see what the rockers a valves are doing before going any further . This is where it get messy I suppose with flat engines . Inline fours are so much easier when it comes to getting at the valve train - and theres only one of everything major not two .
BTW Paul said its pointless putting SUIC into a cold engine .

A .

[discopotato03]

Quick question , do the cam covers come of without removing the rear belt covers ?

Hoping they do cheers A .

[steptoe]

yep, just how much hands on did you have in Ellies build ?

Dizzy side has the extra bolt right at the back end

[El_Freddo]

yep, just how much hands on did you have in Ellies build ?

Hehehe... I too did this No offence disco! I thought you'd already know this...

Cheers

Bennie

[discopotato03]

I didn't strip or build that engine , a lot of extra parts came to me in boxes (most of a 2nd engine) but as sub assemblies . Mechanically speaking I had the turbo off the original engine and did the belts because it broke one shortly before the current engine went in . I think I had the injectors and distributor out of the original heart early in the peace .
So no have not had the covers/cam boxes/heads off an 82 myself . I do have an idea how much work is involved in removing the radiator , been there as well , and the crank pulley and front covers (3) so taking the rear halves out is more hours lost . Basically I want to try to get at the rockers with the cam boxes in place to see if one they're in place and two if I can see which valves aren't closing . I may be able to tap or otherwise convince them to return to their seats to get some compression happening .

This is why I asked .

A .

[steptoe]

just stirring a big guy from afar .... heaps of respect for you and your knowledge Adrian, and your ability to convey it in so many words for us all

I know that I have been able to get at the rockers with just the RC off when I stuffed up one rocker riding on the valve stem one head time and was able to poke and shift it from under.

Having seen how little a thing can be to reduce compression or even totally do away with the notion at all, it could just be small crumbs jammed under valve contact surface - I can't see that you will be able to discern the difference at the rockers end ?? At this stage I'd be contemplating disconnecting pre cat and seriously thinking of soaking entire intake in petrol or some other solvent, let it sit and drain to sump, end up in turbo, disconnect ignition and roll it down a hill to encourage suspect to move on.....sounds crude and redickerless enough to work ??

All with an oil change at the successful end

[discopotato03]

I spoke to Gareth (original Mr CrossBred) and AJ who built my engine along with god knows how many hundreds over a life time .
Gee said same look inside camboxes . I've got the cover off the nearside (RHS) bank and not surprisingly its hard to see too much I suppose without a small mirror . The rockers on that side are in place and tomorrow I'll turn it over by hand to make sure the rockers follow the cam lobes , the rocker that was on one of the lobes back felt tight so no clearence anyway . PITA that the rear lower bolt is a pain to get at and has to come out with the cover itself .
I don't think I'll even try to pull the turbo side one off with the PS pipes etc in the way .

AJ reckons I should try spraying some carby cleaner through my engine from the same places I sprayed the SUEC in reasoning that it may just disolve enough crud to get some valve sealing . Also it evaporates away leaving nothing behind . Coxy has a large spray bottle at work which you pump up with a hand plunger and they get carby cleaner in bulk drums . Will put it to him tonight if I can catch up with him .
Def have to pull fuses or whatever to power down the ignition system otherwise Ellie will be the first RX in orbit .
I think my last hope is to crank through enough caustic anything carbon eating spray and hope it frees things up . Actually I suppose we could blast around inside the plug holes with compressed air to remove any crud or pressurise the chambers at TDC in the vain hopes that the pressure pushes the valves shut .

Finger s crossed , cheers A .