brumby starting issue

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:58 pm

went to fire up the trusty brumby last night to head around to a mates 21st to find my trusty brumby wasnt so trusty

it started fine and was idling for about a minute then just stopped and now wont start.

i opened the bonnet and i see that the fuel filter had no petrol even though i had half a tank.

i got a syringe and injected some petrol in the filter through the top to fill it up and the lines, some start ya bastard in the carby and we were off

but then it just stopped even with the throttle on

repeated this a couple of times, some times the fuel filter would be dry and i would have to pump in more fuel other times it would be full but still stopped.

any ideas on what it could be at all?? i was thinking dicky fuel pump but unsure and wouldn't even know to look on the brumby so some pointers and things to try would be great

Post by **TOONGA** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:37 pm

this problem has surfaced before and it wasn't a blockage, it wasn't the fuel pump or filters... turns out it was the relay that stops the pump when the distributor isn't turning.

not sure where it lives in a brumby, but there is a thread on the board about it somewhere.

anyone else remember?

TOONGA

Post by **Bantum** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:50 pm

There are about 3 - 4 relays just above the coil ( on driver's side ) check them out if they are working correctly ( with multimeter etc ) - they can burn out or have sticky contacts. Replace if not working ...

Sorry I don't recall which one, as they can be placed in different order ...

Post by **TOONGA** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:01 pm

Bantum wrote:There are about 3 - 4 relays just above the coil ( on driver's side ) check them out if they are working correctly ( with multimeter etc ) - they can burn out or have sticky contacts. Replace if not working ...
Sorry I don't recall which one, as they can be placed in different order ...

nope not them they are for the aircon normally, the relay for the fuel pump has 6 prongs from memory.

TOONGA

Post by **Bantum** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:34 pm

I think there are also some under the dash ( drivers side, going from memory ) but don't recall a specific location of fuel pump relay, sorry ...

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Sun Sep 23, 2012 4:47 pm

Bantum wrote:I think there are also some under the dash ( drivers side, going from memory ) but don't recall a specific location of fuel pump relay, sorry ...

i really hope there not under the dash

thanks guys i will try and find that thread hoping its a easy fix, now that i dont have my forester i rely on brumby a lot more then i used too

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 7:49 am

Oh yeah, rings a bell. Thy are up on the drivers side almost on the inside of the firewall - in L Series and think same on MY/Brumby.

I'd blame pump first and not just coz i have a brand new one sitting here - for sale

Fedtro FED 40106 on the box label and pump itself, was bought for a Brumby, never used coz someone rushed in to buy a new pump

$20 plus postage and it's yours

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 9:16 am

steptoe wrote:
$20 plus postage and it's yours

ill try a few other little things and report back

Post by **Bantum** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:55 pm

thunder039 wrote: ... I really hope there not under the dash ...

Hmm Yep - I just did a google search and confirmed that :

... the fuel pump relay / control module is located under the left side of the steering column. You are looking for a small black block, about 2-3" square with i think about 5 or 6 wires going into it ...

Read more: Where is the fuel pump relay switch located on a 1987 subaru brat ?
Answerbag http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/743527#ixzz27N5LoYRG

It might also pay to check the fuses :
showthread.php?t=14769

However a post on here says ...

TOONGA wrote: ... there is a relay behind the passenger set on the cab wall a bugger to get to but this could be the problem it stops the fuel from pumping if it doesn't receive a signal from the dizzy/coil saying the engine is turning. ...

link : showthread.php?t=19316&highlight=brumby+fuel+relay

So still none the wiser ...

Post by **TOONGA** » Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:35 pm

Neither am I

As Ive since been told that the relay I was talking about, might well be for the rear brakes.

And that black relay is in the 1984 wagon it is bolted to the bonnet release bracket, but I've never seen one in a brumby in that position.

Sorry

TOONGA

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:30 am

yeah, just what is that box of tricks on the rear cabin wall? I thought it was a thing for the light out reporting thing in the dash. Was an idea, that is all...

BK Cam or Sam has the factory manuals .......

Brumby Kid · Post by **Brumby Kid** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:49 am

steptoe wrote:yeah, just what is that box of tricks on the rear cabin wall? I thought it was a thing for the light out reporting thing in the dash. Was an idea, that is all...

BK Cam or Sam has the factory manuals .......

What!?!? Do I?!?!
Yeah nah on a cd, let me know what you need.
To get to that Relay, you need to rip the vynal stuff off the cab. ( I mean rip) just some little plugs holding it in.
Pretty easy to do.
Check out my body work thread for more pics.

Cheers Cam

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:24 am

thanks a lot guys this has been really helpful!

unfortunately i haven't been able to look at the car since starting this thread as ive been busy hoping simple like fuse or the pump it self, dont really want to be ripping the inside of my car apart

Post by **TOONGA** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:22 am

Not a problem I have done 2 searches of the board for the thread Im looking for, to no avail. a father had bought his daughter a wagon (my) and it wouldn't idle sometimes or run and other times it did. turned out it was the fuel cut out solenoid (thats what it is called in the FSM) and not the one on the carby which is the fuel idle solenoid

You may want to check that as well as those buggers can play up as well.

TOONGA

Post by **Bantum** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:48 pm

TOONGA wrote: ... And that black relay is in the 1984 wagon it is bolted to the bonnet release bracket, but I've never seen one in a brumby in that position ...

That one I beleive is the power window module seen here :
showpost.php?p=202960&postcount=41

& is usually found in wagons ...

See following post ...

Post by **TOONGA** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:12 pm

Bantum thats probably correct about the power window relay as well. as I can't find the thread that I was looking for, or remember which memeber posted the original topic.

I noticed that you have gutted a car for its harness did you take the fuel pump wiring or just the dash and engine associated wiring?

As if you have the fuel pump wiring, then you could trace back to the solenoid from that wiring.

TOONGA

Post by **Bantum** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:37 pm

TOONGA wrote: ... I noticed that you have gutted a car for its harness did you take the fuel pump wiring or just the dash and engine associated wiring? ...

I took the wiring from a touring wagon, with electronic dash, engine bay + front door harness for MY auto window conversion.

Sorry I can't show you any more untill it's finished ...

Post by **Bantum** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:48 pm

This should help with location of parts ...

http://webmonkees.com/art/sub/85bratwires.jpg

Note : there is no realy for the fuel pump ...

There should be only two wires from it : Black goes to earth, Black + white goes to ignition / coil.

Item 60 ( in top right of wriring diagram ) is the stop lamp control unit ...

Which Brumby Kid has kindly photographed - & is located in center, just above floor tunnel. You can also see wires go through the grommet for fuel pump just to the right.

Hope this clears things up ...

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:18 pm

Bantum wrote:This should help with location of parts ...

http://webmonkees.com/art/sub/85bratwires.jpg

Note : there is no realy for the fuel pump ...
There should be only two wires from it : Black goes to earth, Black + white goes to ignition / coil.

Item 60 ( in top right of wriring diagram ) is the stop lamp control unit ...

Which Brumby Kid has kindly photographed - & is located in center, just above floor tunnel. You can also see wires go through the grommet for fuel pump just to the right.

Hope this clears things up ...

thanks a lot!

so just to clarify

1. no need to rip up my floor vinal to check the relay unit?
2. there is no relays for the fuel pump?
3. therefore the only things it could be is a block, a stuffed pump or a fuse?

once again thanks heaps:D

Post by **TOONGA** » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:59 pm

Ok so if there is no relay for the fuel pump then, why does the fuel pump prime when the ignition is turned on but doesn't continue to prime? and why does it stop when the engine stalls?

I know there is a relay for the fuel pump, but I don't know where it is as both the things I assumed were the relay are not.

Bantum I have that schematic and it isn't for the 1989 brumby, as it has a ballast resistor. the 1989 brumby has an electronic distributor not a points distributor.

thunder039 I'm not sure why you want to rip up your vinyl but I'm pretty sure you wouldn't had to to get to that relay behind the seats.

When I'm not looking after children or driving 240km in a round trip for work, I will find this mystery relay in my 89 brumby.

TOONGA

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