I would be interest in comments on the right oil for EJ series engines.
Have any problems been attributed to synthetic oils?
What is the best SAE rating?
5 -40 or 15 -50, the later is recommended for worn engines.
10-40 is recommended in manual with a warning not to use 5 -30 for sustatined high speed driving
Engine oil
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AlpineRaven
- Senior Member
- Posts: 3682
- Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia.
I'd stick with 10-40 oils.
I'm using Castrol Magetic because that is the oil that my Liberty has been using since new in 1996, so I'm sticking to that oil because its the oil that engine is used to..
Cheers
AP
I'm using Castrol Magetic because that is the oil that my Liberty has been using since new in 1996, so I'm sticking to that oil because its the oil that engine is used to..
Cheers
AP
Subarus that I have/had:
1995 Liberty "Rallye" - 5MT AWD, LSD - *written off 25/8/06 in towing accident.
1996 Liberty Wagon - SkiFX AWD 5MT D/R, Lifted.. Outback Sway Bar, 1.59:1 Low Gearing see thread: 1.59:1 in EJ Box Page
Sold at 385,000kms in July 2011.
2007 Liberty BP Wagon, 2.5i automatic
1995 Liberty "Rallye" - 5MT AWD, LSD - *written off 25/8/06 in towing accident.
1996 Liberty Wagon - SkiFX AWD 5MT D/R, Lifted.. Outback Sway Bar, 1.59:1 Low Gearing see thread: 1.59:1 in EJ Box Page
Sold at 385,000kms in July 2011.
2007 Liberty BP Wagon, 2.5i automatic
Thanks guys. I found a handy link for Shell oils that you put in your make and model and get recommended oils and coolant. For my liberty 1995 the premium recommended is Helix Ultra 5 - 40. That is exactly what I have been using, good guess!
link: http://www.shell.com.au/home/page/aus/p ... match.html
link: http://www.shell.com.au/home/page/aus/p ... match.html
I have further researched to understand the oil rating system and read independant comparitive oil testing.
Testing rates Mobil 1 as one of the best. In short term life testing the viscosity only thinned about 1%. Shell Ultra was one of five tested that had significant thinning, about 15%. The testers therefore suggest that over a longer service period there would likely be better and more consistent performance from Mobil 1.
I have chosen the top grade for my rebuilt engine, rated 0W-40. What does this rating mean? The 40 SAE is the operating viscosity at 100C and is ideal for the hot conditions we have in Australia. The 0W is not an actual viscosity rating (would not get a zero viscosity rating at freezing temps), it is a strange equivalence rating, this Winter(W) rating is more about a rating of oil thickening at low temperatures. Therefore 0 = no thickening (excellent for very cold conditions). The higher this number, the higher the thickening. So when using this oil there is no danger of it being too thin under normal operation as some think by looking at the low number. This low rating does indicate that the oil remains non thickened when cold, enabling rapid oil deployment during starting conditions.
Mobil 1 is fully synthetic and therefore requires none of the additives needed for petroleum based oils to perform well. It is these additives that degrade during life and as a result there is deterioration and thickening with the high risk of deposit build up. Mobil 1 keeps the engine very clean and has a much longer service life. For more info this is a good link: http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/moto ... index.html
Testing rates Mobil 1 as one of the best. In short term life testing the viscosity only thinned about 1%. Shell Ultra was one of five tested that had significant thinning, about 15%. The testers therefore suggest that over a longer service period there would likely be better and more consistent performance from Mobil 1.
I have chosen the top grade for my rebuilt engine, rated 0W-40. What does this rating mean? The 40 SAE is the operating viscosity at 100C and is ideal for the hot conditions we have in Australia. The 0W is not an actual viscosity rating (would not get a zero viscosity rating at freezing temps), it is a strange equivalence rating, this Winter(W) rating is more about a rating of oil thickening at low temperatures. Therefore 0 = no thickening (excellent for very cold conditions). The higher this number, the higher the thickening. So when using this oil there is no danger of it being too thin under normal operation as some think by looking at the low number. This low rating does indicate that the oil remains non thickened when cold, enabling rapid oil deployment during starting conditions.
Mobil 1 is fully synthetic and therefore requires none of the additives needed for petroleum based oils to perform well. It is these additives that degrade during life and as a result there is deterioration and thickening with the high risk of deposit build up. Mobil 1 keeps the engine very clean and has a much longer service life. For more info this is a good link: http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/moto ... index.html
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El_Freddo
- Master Member
- Posts: 12626
- Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 10:00 am
- Location: Bridgewater Vic
- Contact:
Interesting. This could be why my EJ struggles for a period of time on the way to work in a rush on a cold morning.steptoe wrote:only warnings I have seen re oil for ej's is not to use the wrong one to avoid thicker oils causing valve lifter pump up holding ya valves open - engine can cut out !
I might have to check out another oil at the next change - I just use some no name oil type that's apparenlty a rebadged name brand oil. Its just a good price and works well so far.davmax wrote:I have chosen the top grade for my rebuilt engine, rated 0W-40. What does this rating mean? The 40 SAE is the operating viscosity at 100C and is ideal for the hot conditions we have in Australia. The 0W is a viscosity rating, however the Winter(W) rating is more about a rating of oil thickening at low temperatures. Therefore 0 = no thickening (excellent for very cold conditions). The higher this number, the higher the thickening. So when using this oil there is no danger of it being too thin under normal operation as some think by looking at the low number. However this low rating does indicate that the oil remains at a low viscosity when cold, enabling rapid oil deployment during starting conditions.
Cheers
Bennie
El Freddo. Unfortunately it is very difficult to tell how oil is performing until it is too late.
Synthetics are far better, costing more but longer life between changes and saving your engine.
Take a read of this: http://www.performanceoilnews.com/oils_ ... oils.shtml
Synthetics are far better, costing more but longer life between changes and saving your engine.
Take a read of this: http://www.performanceoilnews.com/oils_ ... oils.shtml
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discopotato03
- Senior Member
- Posts: 2134
- Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 9:29 am
- Location: Sydney
I don't agree with the last bit , a true synthetic oil stands up longer but it is no less problematic with gradual builds up of contaminants in it .
People like to think good synthetic oils are bullet proof but the only way to get the crud out is to drain it out with the oil .
The first number in the oils rating is actually a cold pouring index , actually I think the "W" is supposed to be a "Winter" rating .
Engines with lots of miles on them are never going to be clean things inside , ring blow by and leakage past valve guides means combustion gasses into the crank case area and the oil mist here absorbs much of this crud .
Oil filters don't remove much of it because it stays suspended in the fluid and gets continually pumped around the lubricating system . Long term the acids begin to attack things and the oil film doesn't lubricate as well as it should . The crud can leave a honey coloured varnish like substance all over the insides of everything in the crank case and you'd think the oil galleries .
IMO ideally the best practise is to use a reasonable oil and change it at regular intervals . Budget oil still lubricates but its usefull life will be shorter meaning change it more often .
Real synthetics generally have a wider heat range and form a much more durable oil film that many mineral oils particularly at high temperatures . They also tend to be more fluid (less viscous) when cold so kinder at cold starts .
My Subaru WSM's recommend a 15Wxx rated oil for an EA82 and thats what I use , it just happens to be a four stroke race bike Mobil 1 15W50 .
Most are never going to pay $16/L but my 82 was rebuilt at great cost so I want to take care of it .
You can probably look at todays sport bike engines as you would a full competition car engine because they run in a much higher state of tune . Not surprisingly they work their oil pretty hard , often the engine is cooled by a large oil cooler and fins on the barrels and heads only . Throw a straight cut gearbox and a multi wet plate clutch into the oil and that many sports bikes today . These bikes sometimes pull telephone number revs and get lots of localised hot spots so they lead a pretty hard life and expect a lot of the oil trying to keep them alive .
When I go through Ripco I always glance at their Mobil range and often its only a car type 5W50 and it floats around $80-90 for 5L . I pay $81 for 5L of the bike stuff for my Skylines RB25DET because I think its better oil .
When the Sube still had its worn leaky EA82T I was using a mineral 15W40 because it was using/leaking it too fast to justify expensive synthetic oil - which leaked out of like a sieve anyway .
IMO if you have a young fresh engine that you intend to keep to a high mileage put good oil in it and change at ~ 5-7000Km . If its an old dunger but you need to keep it alive feed it cheaper oil but still change it regularly . ALWAYS change the filter every time . A car in its senior years is like a body getting on time wise , trouble is people see less value in the old car and service it regularly - like when it won't move .
If it has to be reliable look after it or it can't look after you .
Cheers A .
People like to think good synthetic oils are bullet proof but the only way to get the crud out is to drain it out with the oil .
The first number in the oils rating is actually a cold pouring index , actually I think the "W" is supposed to be a "Winter" rating .
Engines with lots of miles on them are never going to be clean things inside , ring blow by and leakage past valve guides means combustion gasses into the crank case area and the oil mist here absorbs much of this crud .
Oil filters don't remove much of it because it stays suspended in the fluid and gets continually pumped around the lubricating system . Long term the acids begin to attack things and the oil film doesn't lubricate as well as it should . The crud can leave a honey coloured varnish like substance all over the insides of everything in the crank case and you'd think the oil galleries .
IMO ideally the best practise is to use a reasonable oil and change it at regular intervals . Budget oil still lubricates but its usefull life will be shorter meaning change it more often .
Real synthetics generally have a wider heat range and form a much more durable oil film that many mineral oils particularly at high temperatures . They also tend to be more fluid (less viscous) when cold so kinder at cold starts .
My Subaru WSM's recommend a 15Wxx rated oil for an EA82 and thats what I use , it just happens to be a four stroke race bike Mobil 1 15W50 .
Most are never going to pay $16/L but my 82 was rebuilt at great cost so I want to take care of it .
You can probably look at todays sport bike engines as you would a full competition car engine because they run in a much higher state of tune . Not surprisingly they work their oil pretty hard , often the engine is cooled by a large oil cooler and fins on the barrels and heads only . Throw a straight cut gearbox and a multi wet plate clutch into the oil and that many sports bikes today . These bikes sometimes pull telephone number revs and get lots of localised hot spots so they lead a pretty hard life and expect a lot of the oil trying to keep them alive .
When I go through Ripco I always glance at their Mobil range and often its only a car type 5W50 and it floats around $80-90 for 5L . I pay $81 for 5L of the bike stuff for my Skylines RB25DET because I think its better oil .
When the Sube still had its worn leaky EA82T I was using a mineral 15W40 because it was using/leaking it too fast to justify expensive synthetic oil - which leaked out of like a sieve anyway .
IMO if you have a young fresh engine that you intend to keep to a high mileage put good oil in it and change at ~ 5-7000Km . If its an old dunger but you need to keep it alive feed it cheaper oil but still change it regularly . ALWAYS change the filter every time . A car in its senior years is like a body getting on time wise , trouble is people see less value in the old car and service it regularly - like when it won't move .
If it has to be reliable look after it or it can't look after you .
Cheers A .
Discopotato03. Thanks for your inputs and experiences. I am not sure that you read my input on oil viscosity because I clearly mentioned the WINTER rating. Also I wonder about your input about the 15W recommendation for your EA82. This is not the operational number, it is related to freezing starts, the 50 part of the 15W-50 is the important figure for running conditions. If a manufacturer recommends 40 this should not be exceeded except for worn engines or exceptionally hot operation.
You are right a good oil can never make up for a bad past. I do however remember reading that Mobil 1 keeps an engine very clean. See this link: http://www.mobil1.com.au/why/index.aspx and click on the exceptional cleaning power logo.
I have been very fortunate that the first oil to go into my rebuild engine(like new) is Mobil 1 0W-40, 40 being the max for this engine, it normally sells for $90 for 5L but was on special at Repco for $75.00.
Your final comment is spot on.
You are right a good oil can never make up for a bad past. I do however remember reading that Mobil 1 keeps an engine very clean. See this link: http://www.mobil1.com.au/why/index.aspx and click on the exceptional cleaning power logo.
I have been very fortunate that the first oil to go into my rebuild engine(like new) is Mobil 1 0W-40, 40 being the max for this engine, it normally sells for $90 for 5L but was on special at Repco for $75.00.
Your final comment is spot on.