EA81 head reconditioning

scoobymine · Post by **scoobymine** » Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:08 pm

Can anyone give me what a fair and reasonable cost would be for cylinder head overhauls. Thinking that it might be time to get the heads done up for unleaded, instead of the hassel of using additive.
Happy new year to all.
(my Brumby turns 30 this year)

555Ron · Post by **555Ron** » Wed Jan 02, 2013 6:45 pm

Hmm... if all you wanted was to not have to add valve additive then most say it will be ok in an alloy head.

showthread.php?t=21843&highlight=valve+additive

I have an 83 Wagon and I'm not going to bother with additive.

How much your head would cost depends on what you want to get done...

http://www.ramengines.com/id17.html

And here is some prices of a complete engine rebuild broken down by BrumbyKid

showthread.php?t=21310&highlight=bianca&page=7

scoobymine · Post by **scoobymine** » Wed Jan 02, 2013 8:31 pm

Thanks Ron.
The additive thing has been discussed before with most saying to keep putting it in, so i don't really know. just thought have the usual stuff done, springs, valves, guides etc.
I'll have a look at your links.
Cheers Rick

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:10 am

Ask the shops for a quote on your heads you supply them as there is a few variables as to what is needed, what is not with each application

littlewhiteute · Post by **littlewhiteute** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:06 pm

Any engine with valve seat inserts which includes ALL alloy heads are capable of running unleaded.

sublime · Post by **sublime** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 5:36 pm

scoobymine wrote:Thanks Ron.
The additive thing has been discussed before with most saying to keep putting it in, so i don't really know.
Cheers Rick

+1 for littlewhiteute!

Subaru engines, being all alloy do not need any fuel additive. Anyone using an additive in their Subaru is simply wasting money.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 6:09 pm

+2 but he is erring on side of caution.

I was convinced when I read a technical article in a trade journal explaining same - if it is alloy head it has hardened valve seats to suit unleaded. But then again, I have read in similar for head gasket retension to back off bolts, remove them even, oil them then start again. My machine shop guys say never back 'em off - trust them more than text !

Never used it in my life of Subies, not even with LPG , never a problem with valve seats

RSR 555 · Post by **RSR 555** » Thu Jan 03, 2013 10:41 pm

Happy New Year to you too Rick

I'm of the same opinion that Subaru engines where built for unleaded fuel back in the late 60s, as by 1976 Japan didn't use leaded fuels, so you really shouldn't need to add any additives.

If you're doing the heads because of other reasons, then just have them fully serviced which I get charged around $200/head. Just remember once the engine is put back together, run it up to temp, let it cool, retension the head nuts and reset the rockers.

scoobymine · Post by **scoobymine** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 10:14 am

Thanks Ron and the boys,

Very helpfull information. I'm in two minds at the moment about the heads, as for reconditioning. I'm getting what appears to be a lifter noise on start up that disappears after a couple of minutes, and from what i've read on the forums, it's common with the EA81. She really is a little beauty for a 30 year old ute, and i really want to keep her going, and going well. At under 200,000k's she should have a long way to go. It's the lifter noise that bugs me. I have also toyed with the idea of finding another EA81 and slowly doing it up.
Your thoughts are very welcome.
Cheers Rick

RSR 555 · Post by **RSR 555** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 11:48 am

scoobymine wrote:I have also toyed with the idea of finding another EA81 and slowly doing it up.

I have one (suitable for rebuild) you can have for $100 that came from a late Brumby. I was keeping it for a buggy but going a different way now.

555Ron · Post by **555Ron** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 12:24 pm

scoobymine wrote:Thanks Ron and the boys,

Very helpfull information. I'm in two minds at the moment about the heads, as for reconditioning. I'm getting what appears to be a lifter noise on start up that disappears after a couple of minutes, and from what i've read on the forums, it's common with the EA81. She really is a little beauty for a 30 year old ute, and i really want to keep her going, and going well. At under 200,000k's she should have a long way to go. It's the lifter noise that bugs me. I have also toyed with the idea of finding another EA81 and slowly doing it up.
Your thoughts are very welcome.
Cheers Rick

Well, I could be wrong but I think it was pre '84 the Ea81's came with solid lifters so it shouldn't be them making the noise. It may just be that you need to adjust the rockers to get the right clearance to quieten it down. Not sure what the specs are as I haven't done it on an Ea81 but it's not difficult to do. (I did it on my bike when it was noisy) If it is running nicely maybe that is all that is needed - if it ain't broke don't fix it.

If I'm wrong, littlewhiteute will hopefully correct me, he knows what he's talking about...

scoobymine · Post by **scoobymine** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:01 pm

Once again, thanks Ron.
When i had the motor out, i re set the clearances while it was on the bench. I followed the Gregories inlet 0.23-0.27mm exhaust 0.33-0.37
They actually felt a little tight, and i reset them at 0.24 & 0.34 respectively. That's when i got the rattle. I didn't want to risk making them too tight, but never took into consideration that the springs may be a little worn. I certainly don't have the dosh or the inclination to spend a stack on it. She does fly when she's warm, and the Weber has been a worthwhile addition. perhaps it's time to revisit the tappet clearances.

Silverbullet · Post by **Silverbullet** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:36 pm

And the clearances in the book aren't necessarily correct for your engine, depending on wear etc. I set mine to factory once and they were worse than when I started

scoobymine · Post by **scoobymine** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 5:04 pm

So what's your recommendation Silverbullet?

littlewhiteute · Post by **littlewhiteute** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:24 pm

The Gregorys specs are way too loose, especially on the exhaust.

I set mine at 0.15 inlet (.006 ), 0.20 (.008 ) exhaust cold.

Beware about the "incorrect" clearance measurement you'll get while measuring between a worn rocker arm pad and the valve stem.

Brumby Kid · Post by **Brumby Kid** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:45 pm

What about if your cam has had a torquey grind and has been advanced a tooth or so?
Use the same specs?

littlewhiteute · Post by **littlewhiteute** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 8:56 pm

Brumby Kid wrote:What about if your cam has had a torquey grind and has been advanced a tooth or so?
Use the same specs?

I'd use the minimum clearance as specified by the cam grinder.

"Advanced a tooth or so" is way too much and should be setup with an offset keyway, degree wheel and a dial indicator etc.

Brumby Kid · Post by **Brumby Kid** » Fri Jan 04, 2013 9:53 pm

Ok, I might take a photo of the spec sheet I was given and see if you can interpret it.
We don't know for sure but from our experience doing the timing we believe the engine builder may have done this. But he is an absolute expert.

Cheers Cam

littlewhiteute · Post by **littlewhiteute** » Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:51 am

Brumby Kid wrote:Ok, I might take a photo of the spec sheet I was given and see if you can interpret it.
We don't know for sure but from our experience doing the timing we believe the engine builder may have done this. But he is an absolute expert.

Cheers Cam

Yes, please do, I'm keen to look at it.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Sat Jan 05, 2013 7:33 am

Then there is Jonnos tappet tolerances on his EA81 with 16/56 and 20/60 cam - figuring it is safe to set the buggers at operating temp to ensure there is still at least some gap then, to 4 thou' IN and EX
My Subaru parts man with decades of experience told me 12 years ago there is no listing on his books for hydraulic lifters for EA81 as no EA81 models were sold in Australia with hydraulics. He is still there and holds same line. I believe him.

I knew my ute to have an API import engine, developed a nasty noise for 10km after replacing the rusted out head welch plugs - water in a hydraulic lifter ?

When I pulled engine down I found hydraulic lifters.Engine never went back together as I had built up a solid lifter power plant. I'm sure a solid lifter unit would develop at least half a horse more power

I could not even source new hydraulics through the internet some years later - when I thought hydraulics were not such a bad idea afterall.

I know my little EA81 with 496,000 km on it is original and out of my 92 build ute - waiting to tear it down to checks lifters - hydraulic or solids ? It sometimes makes a noise like a dicky hydraulic, the adjuster have nasty sharp square almosat spring steel anti tamper things on them - suggesting they may be hydraulic???