egr valve

[MTB92]

think you will find 0.5 to 5.0 Volts is the range - and if you can give it the variation and watch as you do you may find the problem, maybe not if the O2 sensors are known to be working fine on other engines......

they are working on other engines, but they are getting covered in soot so quickly i suspect it could be causing a compounding effect, not giving it a chance to run properly if we do find the problem.

[made24x4]

if i connect the DMM to the check engine pin while the connectors are unplugged and ignition to 'on' i get 12v, as i should. if i then connect the black plugs the DMM moves between 3-4v and 12v as i think it should when it is giving error codes (of course, the multimeter doesnt refresh fast enough to actually read these 'flashes').
however, when i put a test light on it it wont light up. i have since tracked down the oil light +ve and running that through the battery, so that it is a dash light, exactly like the check engine light should be, and it still wont turn on.

stumped

[El_Freddo]

also would any of those problems above cause a random but regular misfire (as in its always there, but the misfire appears to be spread over all cylinders)?

Tried a known good igniter? Also test the pulses to the injectors to make sure they're firing as they should be.

When was the fuel filter last replaced?

Is the knock sensor in good condition?

Cheers

Bennie

[made24x4]

Tried a known good igniter? Also test the pulses to the injectors to make sure they're firing as they should be.

When was the fuel filter last replaced?

Is the knock sensor in good condition?

Cheers

Bennie

the igniter that was on there was running an ej20 fine, but we swapped to the spares igniter and that was no different. just then put my igniter off my running conversion (MTB92) onto it and no different.

fuel filter about march this year when the conversion to the ej20 took place.

and yeh, the knock sensor is in good nick. its pretty much the only sensor/circuit we haven't swapped from another car. both mine and the spares appear to work fine but are cracked/melted, this one looks new and was working on the ej20 that was in there fine. apart from that from the symptoms i wouldn't suspect the knock sensor would do that...

we have noticed when the throttle is opened quickly it bogs down and misfires and slowly builds itself up to match the throttle, ie its not a quick response like it should be (and even at revs the misfire continues).

how do i go about testing the pulses? they fire so quickly they give a constant voltage on a multimeter.

[steptoe]

err, fuel pressure regulator ? If the diafragem gets a hole in it the vacuum side starts to supply unmetered/unatomised fuel into the inlet manifold ?? Simple test if fpr is easy access - just disconnect vac hose while running and see if fuel piddles out......

[made24x4]

err, fuel pressure regulator ? If the diafragem gets a hole in it the vacuum side starts to supply unmetered/unatomised fuel into the inlet manifold ?? Simple test if fpr is easy access - just disconnect vac hose while running and see if fuel piddles out......

check, 2 different ones tried...
I am near certain the problem of not firing is electrical, not fuel. the over fueling is just a symptom. however, we have tried 2 ignitors, 2 ECU's, 3 coil packs, 3 sets of spark plugs, 1 new set of plugs, brand new leads, we have also put in extra grounds on the wiring.

[RSR 555]

Ok, Questions...

1. Is this an EJ22 or EJ20?
2. What was just done recently, since this issue started?
3. Are the fuel lines on the correct way? Supply (from filter) is the top line.
4. What model car is it converted from? (can you post the ECU number?)
5. Are you plugging the test connectors together? and if so, which ones.. Black or Green?

[MTB92]

Ok, Questions...

1. Is this an EJ22 or EJ20?
2. What was just done recently, since this issue started?
3. Are the fuel lines on the correct way? Supply (from filter) is the top line.
4. What model car is it converted from? (can you post the ECU number?)
5. Are you plugging the test connectors together? and if so, which ones.. Black or Green?

1) EJ22, the car previously had an EJ20 which ran ok, but after bashing the sump in it appears it ran with out sufficient oil supply and quickly went rattly so the decision was made to go to a jap EJ22 (which apparently previously ran well, but was taken out for a wrx conversion. Subarino was asked to cut down the wiring but came back saying the computer belonged to an EJ16 and he couldn't cut it down/ it wouldn't go to an EJ22). we are now running with the inlet manifold and wiring off an aussie gen 1 lib EJ22.

2) the issue has been since we tried the new (Jap) engine, it had no problems with the EJ20 out of impreza.

3) fuel lines are definitely correct, the car is having no trouble getting fuel. by the sooty plugs it is possible it is running rich, but its otherwise sounding quite smooth.

4) The car it came out of is a Jap impreza (even though the block has EJ22 imprinted on it, is it possible it is actually an EJ16??). Is there any other way Jap engines are different to the aussie versions?

5) both black connectors together.

I have only been part of this for the last few days, so i dont completely know the story with the Jap engine...

Robbie

[RSR 555]

1) EJ22, the car previously had an EJ20 which ran ok, but after bashing the sump in it appears it ran with out sufficient oil supply and quickly went rattly so the decision was made to go to a jap EJ22 (which apparently previously ran well, but was taken out for a wrx conversion. Subarino was asked to cut down the wiring but came back saying the computer belonged to an EJ16 and he couldn't cut it down/ it wouldn't go to an EJ22). we are now running with the inlet manifold and wiring off an aussie gen 1 lib EJ22.

2) the issue has been since we tried the new (Jap) engine, it had no problems with the EJ20 out of impreza.

3) fuel lines are definitely correct, the car is having no trouble getting fuel. by the sooty plugs it is possible it is running rich, but its otherwise sounding quite smooth.

4) The car it came out of is a Jap impreza (even though the block has EJ22 imprinted on it, is it possible it is actually an EJ16??). Is there any other way Jap engines are different to the aussie versions?

5) both black connectors together.

I have only been part of this for the last few days, so i dont completely know the story with the Jap engine...

Robbie

Ok Robbie.. this raises more questions but will run the same format/numbers as above.

1. Only ever seeing 1 import EJ22 in the time I spent in Japan, I very much doubt it will be a imported engine (especially with the age of them now) but either way it will not run correctly on EJ20 wiring. The main reason is the crankshaft and camshaft pulleys will have different counts/magnets on the wheels. You'll need to remove the timing wheels and crank gear off the EJ20 and fit them to the EJ22. Personally you'd be a lot better off putting an EJ22 wiring loom and ECU in it.

2. See number 1.

3. Getting fuel to the engine doesn't sound like a problem but if the hoses are around then it will cause the engine to only run at idle and die if you try and rev it.

4. If it has EJ22 in the castings then it will be an EJ22 but very much doubt it's an imported engine. If you're trying to run the EJ16 ECU on the EJ22 then forget it.. it will never work. They run 2 completely different systems. Like I said before, you can swap the timing stuff over (plus use the old manifold off the EJ20) then you'll get it to run but running an EJ22 on EJ16 ECU, then better keep saving for replacement engines every year.

5. Black plugs will get the fault codes from history. Green plugs will show current ones. I would plug the green plugs in and see if the system runs in 'Check Mode' this means fans and fuel pump will cycle on and off every few seconds.

[MTB92]

Ok Robbie.. this raises more questions but will run the same format/numbers as above.

1. Only ever seeing 1 import EJ22 in the time I spent in Japan, I very much doubt it will be a imported engine (especially with the age of them now) but either way it will not run correctly on EJ20 wiring. The main reason is the crankshaft and camshaft pulleys will have different counts/magnets on the wheels. You'll need to remove the timing wheels and crank gear off the EJ20 and fit them to the EJ22. Personally you'd be a lot better off putting an EJ22 wiring loom and ECU in it.

2. See number 1.

3. Getting fuel to the engine doesn't sound like a problem but if the hoses are around then it will cause the engine to only run at idle and die if you try and rev it.

4. If it has EJ22 in the castings then it will be an EJ22 but very much doubt it's an imported engine. If you're trying to run the EJ16 ECU on the EJ22 then forget it.. it will never work. They run 2 completely different systems. Like I said before, you can swap the timing stuff over (plus use the old manifold off the EJ20) then you'll get it to run but running an EJ22 on EJ16 ECU, then better keep saving for replacement engines every year.

5. Black plugs will get the fault codes from history. Green plugs will show current ones. I would plug the green plugs in and see if the system runs in 'Check Mode' this means fans and fuel pump will cycle on and off every few seconds.

Cheers Paul,

1) sorry, i probably didn't word that well, it is running off an aussie gen 1 EJ22 liberty wiring loom, ecu and inlet manifold. I have never seen the ej16 ecu, that was been and gone long before i got involved.

I will investigate the timing magnets, i have a couple of ej's to compare to.

3) i am about 99.9% certain fuel hoses are the correct way round, certainly pump, filter and then into the main fuel line is correct. one of the first things we looked at.

4) ok, defs an EJ22 then. dunno on the import front, its just what i have been told. but i will check on these timing magnets anyway

5) i did try different combinations, knowing that they gave different types of checks. i didn't look up what was what though. i dont remember hearing fans or fuel pump come on when i had them connected however...

[RSR 555]

Cheers Paul,

1) sorry, i probably didn't word that well, it is running off an aussie gen 1 EJ22 liberty wiring loom, ecu and inlet manifold. I have never seen the ej16 ecu, that was been and gone long before i got involved.

2) I will investigate the timing magnets, i have a couple of ej's to compare to.

3) i am about 99.9% certain fuel hoses are the correct way round, certainly pump, filter and then into the main fuel line is correct. one of the first things we looked at.

4) ok, defs an EJ22 then. dunno on the import front, its just what i have been told. but i will check on these timing magnets anyway

5) i did try different combinations, knowing that they gave different types of checks. i didn't look up what was what though. i dont remember hearing fans or fuel pump come on when i had them connected however...

1. Sorry probably my bad reading skills. Ok, if it's Gen1 wiring/ECU on a EJ22 then all should be fine. Just check that the injector loom is connected to the correct injector. The ones with the little silver/white sticker should be the for #1 & #2

2. If it's EJ22 loom wiring/ECU then all should be fine but may need to check the timing belt is in the correct position. When the keyway on the crank is pointing at 6 o'clock, then the little mark on the crank's timing gear needs to line up with the notch on the top of the oil pump. Once this is in the right spot, check the camshaft pulley's mark (small single mark on the outer side of the wheel) are pointting to 12 o'clock.

3. Sorry, I'm sure you have it right way round, it's just I've seen it so many times it's unreal.

4. EJ22 should have 2 metal camshaft timing wheels (with 5 little tabs on the back of it.. 2 of the tabs will be right next to either other) and the crank pulley should only have 6 tabs sticking out of it. Once everything is in the right, check the compression ratio on all 4 cylinders.

5. Like with most conversions, unless they are done properly, they might not work as they were built to. Having just the green plugs connected and the ignition on, you should be able to here the fuel pump cycling but who knows??

Very hard to do test over the net but as long as you have the basics, the engine should run. Running rich could be from a number of things like injectors staying open, knock sensor failed, AFM not reading right, etc, etc.. without the error codes it's going to be a replace all sensors (one at a time) with good known ones and then test run it.

[RSR 555]

Cheers Paul,

1) sorry, i probably didn't word that well, it is running off an aussie gen 1 EJ22 liberty wiring loom, ecu and inlet manifold. I have never seen the ej16 ecu, that was been and gone long before i got involved.

2) I will investigate the timing magnets, i have a couple of ej's to compare to.

3) i am about 99.9% certain fuel hoses are the correct way round, certainly pump, filter and then into the main fuel line is correct. one of the first things we looked at.

4) ok, defs an EJ22 then. dunno on the import front, its just what i have been told. but i will check on these timing magnets anyway

5) i did try different combinations, knowing that they gave different types of checks. i didn't look up what was what though. i dont remember hearing fans or fuel pump come on when i had them connected however...

1. Sorry probably my bad reading skills. Ok, if it's Gen1 wiring/ECU on a EJ22 then all should be fine. Just check that the injector loom is connected to the correct injector. The ones with the little silver/white sticker should be the for #1 & #2

2. If it's EJ22 loom wiring/ECU then all should be fine but may need to check the timing belt is in the correct position. When the keyway on the crank is pointing at 6 o'clock, then the little mark on the crank's timing gear needs to line up with the notch on the top of the oil pump. Once this is in the right spot, check the camshaft pulley's mark (small single mark on the outer side of the wheel) are pointting to 12 o'clock.

3. Sorry, I'm sure you have it right way round, it's just I've seen it so many times it's unreal.

4. EJ22 should have 2 metal camshaft timing wheels (with 5 little tabs on the back of it.. 2 of the tabs will be right next to either other) and the crank pulley should only have 6 tabs sticking out of it. Once everything is in the right, check the compression ratio on all 4 cylinders.

5. Like with most conversions, unless they are done properly, they might not work as they were built to. Having just the green plugs connected and the ignition on, you should be able to here the fuel pump cycling but who knows??

[El_Freddo]

So has the cut down wiring been used before this conversion?

Who did the cut down? If it was Subarino Dave I would rule out the wiring being the issue.

Interesting what Paul said about the injectors being the right way around!

Cheers

Bennie

[MTB92]

1. Sorry probably my bad reading skills. Ok, if it's Gen1 wiring/ECU on a EJ22 then all should be fine. Just check that the injector loom is connected to the correct injector. The ones with the little silver/white sticker should be the for #1 & #2

2. If it's EJ22 loom wiring/ECU then all should be fine but may need to check the timing belt is in the correct position. When the keyway on the crank is pointing at 6 o'clock, then the little mark on the crank's timing gear needs to line up with the notch on the top of the oil pump. Once this is in the right spot, check the camshaft pulley's mark (small single mark on the outer side of the wheel) are pointting to 12 o'clock.

3. Sorry, I'm sure you have it right way round, it's just I've seen it so many times it's unreal.

4. EJ22 should have 2 metal camshaft timing wheels (with 5 little tabs on the back of it.. 2 of the tabs will be right next to either other) and the crank pulley should only have 6 tabs sticking out of it. Once everything is in the right, check the compression ratio on all 4 cylinders.

5. Like with most conversions, unless they are done properly, they might not work as they were built to. Having just the green plugs connected and the ignition on, you should be able to here the fuel pump cycling but who knows??

Very hard to do test over the net but as long as you have the basics, the engine should run. Running rich could be from a number of things like injectors staying open, knock sensor failed, AFM not reading right, etc, etc.. without the error codes it's going to be a replace all sensors (one at a time) with good known ones and then test run it.

1)can double check the injectors position, but i think its running far to well for them to be the wrong way round. (to give you an idea, it will run on any 2 cylinders).

2) timing matches my car and another EJ22 in the yard, both of which run.

4) compression 165 to 175 on all cylinders

5) fans on this car are actually controlled by L series fan and remote switch, but who knows on the fuel pump.

Bennie, i cut down the wiring, but it worked on my car. we also took the harness out of another running EJ22 l series and plugged it in and it ran exactly the same, so its not the wiring.

I am going back to perth, still no idea whats wrong...

[Subydoug]

What spark plugs are you using? Not too cold are they?

Regards

Doug

[TOONGA]

Faulty idle air control valve?

TOONGA

[MTB92]

What spark plugs are you using? Not too cold are they?

Regards

Doug

bosch somethings, brand spankers. and cold? well it has been 30+ weather and it doesnt improve when the engine is hot...

Faulty idle air control valve?

TOONGA

already swapped out for a known good one.