Some EJ22 motors are available at a wrecking yard...

2nd Hand Yank · Post by **2nd Hand Yank** » Sun Apr 08, 2012 10:49 pm

One is a 2000 model, but with 350,000 kms.
I looked on Wikipedia and found that starting 1999, they had an EJ22 called "Phase 2" which suposedly included valve train, cylinder head, lubrication and bottom end modifications. This motor is supposed to have about 12 hp more and 14 ft-lbs more than its predecessor. (142hp/149 ft lbs) I also noticed that the torque peak is made at a lower rpm. I'm curious if a motor like this would be worth a look, if I'm willing to have it rebuilt.

Another is a 1998 model with 200,000-something kms.

I also read that starting 1997 EJ22's had several improvements over the previous generation.

All of these motors are from cars with manual transmissions and the asking price is the same, regardless. $600-700? Probably includes everything out of the cars too for whoever the buyer is.

Or do both of these motors sound like they've clocked too many km's for the asking price and I can find better if I'm patient?

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Sun Apr 08, 2012 11:03 pm

A lot of this comes down to budget. The 350k km EJ could be a better engine than the 200k km one simply due to the maintenance that the two different owners put into the engines and how they were driven.

Ultimately 350k km isn't bad on an EJ22, or any subaru engine for that matter, they're only broken in once they hit the golden 300k km

As for the power figures, basically an EJ22 is going to be a massive upgrade over what you've got now, I'm not sure that you realise just how much of an upgrade it really is! But you'll love it.

If you do buy an engine with higher milage over one with less you could expect to do some more maintenance work on it. The usual pre-conversion maintenance on the EJ's are: water pump and cam belt KIT, not just the belt

This will ensure that the important bits are covered so you're not having to pull your hard work apart to fix something so soon.

The early EJ's go well too, don't write them off simply because they're the earlier ones... The improvements that followed are small things, one that I know of is that the cam rockers went to a roller rocker style over the hydraulic lash adjuster style. Both essentially do the same but the roller I think will rev out more, not that you want to be doing that all the time!

If you can get the cylinder compression readings from the seller. If all cylinders are +or- 10psi all's good, and generally the higher the compression the better. If one cylinder is down on the others suspect a head gasket leak. If all cylinders are lacking pressure near or below 130 psi (I think) I'd leave that one to someone else. Also if it's possible to hear the engine running before you make a purchase this will tell you a bit about the general condition of the engine - listen for knocks on start up. If the engine is knocking forget it - it's probably been thrashed and spun a big end or it's been run too low on oil and needs a bottom end rebuild.

Shop around if you can too! If you're keen to rebuild it before installing it a later model unit might be better over the earlier model unit. Generally speaking the ECU and engine management systems become more efficient plus the parts of these engines are newer over an older engine.

Someone will no doubt have more info to add or will correct me if I'm wrong with something above

Also: Make sure you and the seller know exactly what's included and what's not included in the deal. You want all the parts you can get to make this a smooth operation for yourself. Get the parts from one vehicle so you know they all work together and make sure you've got everything you need, if you don't know what this is just ask. Grab the VIN of the donor vehicle, it'll make getting replacement parts a piece of piss

Hope this helps!

Cheers

Bennie

2nd Hand Yank · Post by **2nd Hand Yank** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:42 pm

Thanks Bennie. Very informative.

You reminded me that I'll want to find a compression tester to test the motor before buying.

Matt · Post by **Matt** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:11 pm

I have a compression testor, i still vote the wrecked whole car is the better option.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:44 pm

WHS, Go grab something like this for probably less than the cost of a wreckers motor and make more back than you paid selling parts, this one is a bit scruffy but 2.5 manual.

http://www.pickles.com.au/damaged/item/ ... /602086748

2nd Hand Yank · Post by **2nd Hand Yank** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:38 pm

d_generate wrote:WHS, Go grab something like this for probably less than the cost of a wreckers motor and make more back than you paid selling parts, this one is a bit scruffy but 2.5 manual.

http://www.pickles.com.au/damaged/item/ ... /602086748

Interesting...

Would this be a manual with a locking centre dif?
Or can I use an adapter plate to mate it to my current L Series 4wd manual trans?

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:42 pm

2nd Hand Yank wrote:Would this be a manual with a locking centre dif?

Once again - there are no locking centre diff EJ gearboxes!

You have to find the L series AWD gearbox, single or dual range it doesn't matter, they both have it.

So to answer your question, this subaru will not have the centre diff lock, it'll have the stock centre LSD and that's it. I doubt it would have the DCCD centre either.

Cheers

Bennie

2nd Hand Yank · Post by **2nd Hand Yank** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:51 pm

^^ Ooops

I had a look at hp and torque specs for a 1997 EJ25 and I think a 1999+ EJ22 sounds nicer:

EJ22 142 hp vs. EJ25 150-155hp

but

EJ22 149ft lbs @3600rpm vs. EJ25 140ft lbs @4000 rpm?

Post by **Alex** » Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:55 pm

Errr. Ej22 past 1999 doesn't exist(in oz at least). I wouldnt buy a pre 2000 ej25 either due to head gasket issues.

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d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 1:57 am

It's just a suggestion but they've usually been fixed by the time they hit 200,000km, just look for gasket poo that's not tidy like the factory. 2.5 would have a lot more torque low down I'm sure, ask Guy.

I just found a couple of locking centers here but bugger all information on them, they speak good English and are very reliable.

http://www.japanparts.com/db/partslist. ... r=&VOLKEY=

Davidov · Post by **Davidov** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:30 am

EJ25 would deffinately have a lot more torque than an EJ22. It is miles ahead of the EJ20. Realisticly considering the weight of your L series anymore power than an EJ22 would be dangerously scary tbh. My EJ25 can spin all 4 of my enormous heavy wheels on road in the dry in my AWD outback.

thunder039 · Post by **thunder039** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 11:36 am

i personally would worrie about what EJ to get there all going to a MASSIVE increase of the EA i own both a ej20 and ej25 and i would personally get what ever most easy to get and for the best price, the EJ20 is deffiantly no slug especially in a light l series so nevr rule it out

B00sting · Post by **B00sting** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:19 pm

The Ej20s i looked at are much cheaper but it was easier for my to buy a complete 02 outback ej25 minus panels. and it worked out about the same by the time you factor in the manual d/r box i wanted and the rear diff etc.

d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:25 pm

You also end up with a nice big bucket of nuts and bolts..............been so handy over the years, I only had to buy about 4 bolts to lift my entire car.

Gannon · Post by **Gannon** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:10 pm

Davidov wrote: My EJ25 can spin all 4 of my enormous heavy wheels on road in the dry in my AWD outback.

Thats a fair claim for an EJ25
Do you mean spin the wheels and leave double 11's when you take off...... or a little chirp when you dump the clutch at 6000rpm? Its just that I find the former a little hard to believe.

MTB92 · Post by **MTB92** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 7:19 pm

d_generate wrote:You also end up with a nice big bucket of nuts and bolts..............been so handy over the years, I only had to buy about 4 bolts to lift my entire car.

spot on!

At the risk of getting too involved were i really dont want to

:
You really need to stop comparing every aspect of every option to minute %'s that wont make a huge difference. saying "one motor is 2.3% more efficient, and outputs 4.3% more torque at the same rpm with 1.6% reduction in power while requiring 6.8% more effort to put in and 1.2% more cost of parts but is 4.7% less likely to need parts for in the future" and then trying to generate an equation is not a constructive way of doing it. (ok i may have exagerated that (and i dont intend it to be offensive either, there are some aspects of life that precision is necessary, but choosing the best motor for a 20yr old wagon is probably not one of them in my opinion)).

an ej20 or less would be a good power and reliabilty upgrade, and possibly legal depending where you are. (before you break out figures, i have driven an ej20 L series and it murders an EA in every single way you can imagine. it was also plenty of power to be a capable 4wd)

An EJ22 is the most common one. a step up from the 2L in power and torque. it has the most amount of help online about it, probably the easiest to do based on instruction with limited experience due to ready wiring diagrams etc. both series one and two EJ22 wiring diagrams are readily available. the downside to these is they will be older engines, yes you will have to do belt seals etc. but many still have plenty of life in them. in my opinion this is the biggest capacity motor you would want to have purely front wheel drive. this is what i currently have

, and it will push you back in your seat quite easily, and makes a nippy car and very capable 4wd. (from my experience: it sounds better, is faster, is more fuel efficient, is more reliable, looks better, runs cooler, more torquey at low revs than an EA82. and from what i hear is as much work to put in as any other EFI)

EJ25 (although i have actually never driven one) would be a step up in torque and power from the 2.2L (like the 2.2L to the 2L). this might be starting to get to the point where things will fatige under the power if they are kept stock and not maintained well. these are newer engines but beware of issues as suggested by others.

EJ20t would be up again

. i have actually never seen one of these in person running, it would be insane. huge amount of work, and you will destroy your car if it is not heavily modified. they are not made for this much power

.

El_Freddo, RSR, Guy, etc have given you sound advice on gearboxes as well, listen to what they say works (having never done anything to a gearbox i am in no position to give advice). i have found pretty much all their advice to be spot on, and best of all they can speek from experience

.

and i really didn't mean to write that much

Post by **Alex** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:34 pm

MTB92 wrote:
EJ20t would be up again . i have actually never seen one of these in person running, it would be insane. huge amount of work, and you will destroy your car if it is not heavily modified. they are not made for this much power .

Bahahaha

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taza · Post by **taza** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:50 pm

Alex wrote:Bahahaha

Yes we all know your a crazy bastard Alex and put an EJ20G behind the stock gearbox. Going from 62Kw (EA82) to 168kW(EJ20G)

Theres very very good advice here Matt. An EJ20 or 22 of any year and model will be fine, if high km get it rebuilt while its out.
Myself included as owning an EJ0 foz, driven a few EJ22 L-Series and owning an EA82 L too.

The EJ22 will through you back in your seat and either will be enough power.

Post by **Alex** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:05 pm

taza wrote:Yes we all know your a crazy bastard Alex and put an EJ20G behind the stock gearbox. Going from 62Kw (EA82) to 168kW(EJ20G)

Theres very very good advice here Matt. An EJ20 or 22 of any year and model will be fine, if high km get it rebuilt while its out.
Myself included as owning an EJ0 foz, driven a few EJ22 L-Series and owning an EA82 L too.

The EJ22 will through you back in your seat and either will be enough power.

Jap spec has abit more go than a aussie 20g

oh and 18psi.

Back on topic. I'd go for a Gen1 Ej22 1989-1993 model. Very strong motor and more than enough poke, enough to belt a v6 commodore off the road.

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d_generate · Post by **d_generate** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:59 pm

I agree with fitting the EJ22 it's just that there weren't any at the Townsville auctions this week but I'm sure they are a regular visitor.

Before I modded my Liberty it was an auto 2.2 and went like a shower if shit for a 4cyl car and they weigh in at 1,320kg so in a L I'd say perfect choice.