Points to reluctor conversion ea81

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Subydoug
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Points to reluctor conversion ea81

Post by Subydoug » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:15 pm

Hey fella's,

Did a conversion from points to a later model brumby's electronic pointless disty today. I got the new distributor a long time ago to replace the one in the wagon as the wagons was pretty flogged out and its vac diaphragm was shot. When I first got it I didn't want to mess around with changing to electronic ignition so I just swapped the guts around and put the points into the new disty body with the good diaphragm and better bushes.
~20000kms later and the points and the points are shot :cool:. Hats off to them though as they are grandad age in point years.

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Anyhow, occurred to me yesterday that I still had all the bits from the new disty. So I pulled it all out and assembled it. Here it is in my old disty body,

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But how do I wire it up? had a quick google of the part number it, found a dinky little photo, wired it up on the bench and gave it a flick,

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Hmmmmm yummy, but wait!? isn't this meant to be a reluctor setup? that square wave output reeks of hall sensor. Yep definitely a hall sensor setup.
For those interested there is very little difference when it comes to hall sensors and reluctors. Both use some form of coil with a magnet. The difference is in the waveform they output.

So, got the disty sorted, now to make a controller to drive the coil....Turns out altronics carry a kit for electronic ignition. Beauty!

Sorry didn't take any pic's off assembling the pcb but I did take a few of it finished.

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Basically it consists of a large high voltage MOSFET to switch the coil to ground, some basic analog circuits to control dwell and debounce and then it supports around 6 different trigger signal types and you populate the parts for the trigger your car uses. I chose hall sensor as that's what was coming out of the disty.

I didn't have any little crimps for inside the disty so I Opted to solder some flying leads onto it with external connectors.

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Did some tidying up of the wires, tucked the ignition module inside its dinky little box and screwed it into the wheel well under the coil.

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Set the timing, job done. As far as improvement goes over the old points, Ignition timing is 10 fold less jumpy. Its more stable then the old ea82 MPFI in the vortex that's for sure. I doubt there was even half a degree (+/-) of drift or erratic behaviour. Idle quality along with cold running quality have dramatically improved. Seat of the pants feel on the road isn't that much different. Maybe slightly smoother but most likely inside my head.

Pretty good upgrade for those who are chasing the pinnacle of reliability in there Subie!

Regards

Doug

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Subydoug
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Post by Subydoug » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:17 pm

Oh forgot to add, there is something wrong in some photos from when I was having a retard moment. can any of you spot it?

Regards

Doug

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Silverbullet
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Post by Silverbullet » Sun Jul 21, 2013 12:09 am

Ballast resistor on an electronic ignition setup? ;)
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steptoe
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Post by steptoe » Sun Jul 21, 2013 3:37 am

saw that too, and the wire so close on the module to the body - insulated? and asking why you need the ignition box ? Most just shove the dizzy in, connect wires to electronic dizzy matching coil , flick the ballast resistor (white ceramic jobbie) an go! None of that fancy wave testing !

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stork955
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Post by stork955 » Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:14 am

G'day, did you swap the coil too? Different primary resistance!

Cheers,

Stork

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Subydoug
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Post by Subydoug » Sun Jul 21, 2013 9:43 am

Ha, yeah ballast resistor still there. He isn't hurting anyone. The ignition control box has this feature where it will increase the debounce period to something massive if there are no trigger pulses within 1 second.
That's actually a pretty bad camera angle there Steptoe as there is plenty of clearance between the terminal and the disty wall. They have a nice blob of goop on them for stress relief. Same goes for all the electronics inside the ignition box, all gooped up to stop fatigue.

This ignition box just has an IGBT in it. Does eactly the same thing as the points used to without the mechanical part. As far as driving a coil straight from the output signal from the disty that seems pretty unrealistic considering its only nearing 1vP-P. There pretty much has to be some sort of high power transistor to switch the inductive coil load.

Stork, I replaced the coil with an MSD blaster 2 a while back. Primary resistance is 0.7ohm on the datasheet. Being an IGBT I can switch pretty much any inductive ignition coil there is. The way I understood it Low impedance coils are more for CDI units which need the low impedance for quick saturation though I'm no real ignition guru so I could be wrong.

Nah the biggest faff up was the reluctor star on upside down. I want to trigger on rising edge so I want the star to swing into the sensor with a very steep angle to get the best trigger edge I can. With it on the way I have it in the pictures Id be better off triggering on a falling edge. The slower decaying slope after the initial rising edge probably helps stop the falling edge from spiking negative.

Someone got a photo of one in a brumby? see which way they are factory?

Regards

Doug

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Post by TOONGA » Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:06 am

Very nice work Doug, I would've put all of that together with the newer dizzy with the better bushes. Or did you do that after you put it all in the old dizzy ? :)

While the reluctor star is on upside down it doesn't seem to make any difference to the wave form. I remember years ago seeing a brumby hooked up to a tune up machine and the signal looked like that. And yes the reluctor setup works in the same fashion as a hall sensor setup.

As for those points I would've got a nail file to them and re gapped them, at least another 10k in them :)

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Subydoug
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Post by Subydoug » Sun Jul 21, 2013 11:15 am

Haha, yeah bit sad to pull them out. They were ol' faithful. All new distributor now, well 20k on the bushes. I did assemble it in the old disty body when I was messing around with it, saved pulling the other one out in the cold :D. Makes for absolutely beautiful idle. I didn't try spinning the reluctor the other way. Did you want me to capture some waveforms and compair? I would emagine it will ring more with it the other way around.

Regards

Doug

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Skull
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Post by Skull » Sun Jul 21, 2013 1:04 pm

The reluctor looks to be fitted correct to me, unless mine has been installed upside down also.
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Subydoug
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Post by Subydoug » Sun Jul 21, 2013 7:16 pm

Yeah, I kind of figured that the "R" was meant to face up. Oh well, running like a champ at the moment so I guess Il just leave it as is.

Regards

Doug

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steptoe
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Post by steptoe » Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:17 am

Hang the smoother idle - we're waiting for the power !

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Subydoug
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Post by Subydoug » Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:59 am

Meh, power feels about the same though I haven't really hammered it yet. I think Il start to see the benefits when I drop in my higher compression engine. With my original coil and points It was chuffing out under 4 lbs of boost.

Regards

Doug

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