gettin clutch beefed

90brumby · Post by **90brumby** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 8:59 pm

ok so im puttin a L series clutch onto the ej22 i believe i need to beef my clutch up

where is the place to get it done in WA
and to wat specs will i need it done to

cheers

BlackMale · Post by **BlackMale** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:39 pm

90brumby wrote:ok so im puttin a L series clutch onto the ej22 i believe i need to beef my clutch up

What makes you think you need this?

I have been open about this with other members but basically the clutch is the weakest link in the driveline system and personally I think that your better off having this as the weak point. I bust stubs axels and stuff now (with a standard clutch) if you increase this you’ll only increase the chances of damage further down the drive line. This is my 2c. I am sure that others will contest it and the local crew will tell you where they had their clutches done.

Subafury · Post by **Subafury** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:39 pm

autoclutch in osborne park. just tell him to get it beefed to just above liberty spec.

90brumby · Post by **90brumby** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:42 pm

BlackMale wrote:What makes you think you need this?

I have been open about this with other members but basically the clutch is the weakest link in the driveline system and personally I think that your better off having this as the weak point. I bust stubs axels and stuff now (with a standard clutch) if you increase this you’ll only increase the chances of damage further down the drive line. This is my 2c. I am sure that others will contest it and the local crew will tell you where they had their clutches done.

ye i have thought bout this but i was lead to believe it would just slip
will the ea82 clutch hold up to the ej22

D3V1L · Post by **D3V1L** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:50 pm

well..based on experience....under heavy loads the stock clutch would simply slip...and burnt out uber quick in the sand

dave

Matatak · Post by **Matatak** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:57 pm

Autoclutch is the way to go. theyve done alot of peoples nowadays lol.

as D3V1L says stock one WILL slip and burnout quickly.

mines like Subarinos at around 2200 Pounds. which is more than other WA members.
i like how mine is. it grabs well. and doesnt slip on me

but alternatively u could just buy a decently beefed up Liberty unit as that will fit onto the Lseries flywheel ive been told.

BlackMale · Post by **BlackMale** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:08 pm

Your going to get a different opinion on this question. Yes you will get slip that’s what I am getting at I would rather burn the clutch then have everything grip and have something else go bang – it’s a bugger to replace but I think the better of 2 evils.

For the record there are a few EJ engines on EA clutch’s and they have been fine even after 4WDing in all terrain.

Just remember its not as simple as getting a beefier clutch I think you should also consider a stronger clutch fork as there have been issues of people bending the the forks due to the increased pressure.

Ultimately the final decision is yours (and as I do not have an EJ engine and EA clutch that’s me done debating this). Good luck with it.

Matatak · Post by **Matatak** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:39 pm

you can still slip a beefed up clutch,

th eonyl time it wont slip is when u drop the clutch. and ofcourse driving sensibly u wuldnt do this.

for the record...i no of a few EJed Lseries running stock clutches whihc are not coping to well.

yes. stronger clutch fork is the go if you go past the Liberty spec IMO

Liberty being like 1500 1600 i thought.

Thats Okka! · Post by **Thats Okka!** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:51 pm

snatch a bogged car with ej22 and ea82 clutch (new) and you wont be driving home......ej22 has WAY too much power for ea82 clutch. Its silly even considering running standard clutch.

bluesteel · Post by **bluesteel** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:55 pm

i have a l series 5mt behind an ej22 in a brumby

im running an rpm clutch which is meant to be beefier than standard but not overkill

only time i have ever got it to slip when it wasnt meant to was changing into 3rd gear off the limiter during a motorkhana oin 4wd trying to spin all 4 and slide round the corner at a great rate of knots

ive broken lots of gear, but never because of dumping the clutch (except in the wrx:()

AndrewT · Post by **AndrewT** » Wed Apr 02, 2008 4:36 pm

If you run an EJ22 with an L series clutch, you need to get the clutch pressure raised to at least that of a factory Liberty - how can this not be logical?
It certainly can't be overkill, I'm sure Subaru would have received complaints from their many Liberty owners!

The pressure that an EA clutch is set to (yes, even the "performance" Exceedy ones for EA82 turbo) is designed to cope with the inferior and less powerful old EA motors.
Quick examples of some people who needed to get their clutch pressure plates beefed after running EA clutches first (I *think* they are accurate);

Vidler (EJ22)
Subarino (EJ22)
Alex (EJ22)

Yes it does make sense to have the clutch as the weakest point in the drivetrain to protect gearboxes etc, but anything less than standard Liberty pressure (I believe around 1790 pounds?) is going to be unusable. They don't last long but this does have a fair bit to do with driver technique and offroad terrain encountered, towing jobs etc.

Yes naturally this will reduce the potential life span of your gearbox and CV joints etc but this is simply because it's a more powerful motor. If you still use the clutch as a clutch and don't keep just dumping it at high revs and shocking everything then things should still be okay.
Even with this, at the end of the day a fair bit of the shock is soaked up by front wheel-spin on the road anyway.
And offroad, alot of people will soon learn than an EJ motor requires less harsh clutch work because of the far superior torque available, they just keep driving with the clutch fully engaged.
Subarino will testify to this, I believe most of the gearboxes he has changed out from behind his custom clutch have been either the same or better condition (except for getting unlucky with one which died of it's own accord I think).

For those who don't know what is actually involved in "beefing" a clutch....
Ross at Autoclutch doesn't actually modify the organic clutch plate itself, but it is a good idea to put a new one in at the same time.
What he does is increases the clamping pressure of the pressure plate part (not to be confused with the flywheel).
He does this by substituting the tongue springs for those from a much larger pressure plate from a different application and custom cutting them down to fit on the smaller L series pressure plate frame. He then changes the angle of these to ensure the friction point will still be at an acceptable position and also to tune the exact pressure - he can get the pressure within 100-150 pounds usually, and will err on the side of more pressure.

You don't really need to custom beef your clutch fork until you exceed about 2000pounds of pressure which shouldn't really be required unless you are running a turbo or supercharged setup.

For the record I had the clutch in my wagon modified like this (standard Outback clutch, same size as L series one) to approx 2200 pounds and it has withstood well over 2 years of very tough driving behind an EJ20turbo motor.
I haven't beefed the clutch fork but because of the Outback EJ gearbox I'm using means I am also using a late model fork to suit a hydraulic system which is quite stronger than an L series one from factory (its different from an early Lib cable one).

There are quite a few people I know of now in WA running their cars with these clutches who have installed them during the conversion rather than inevitably finding out afterwards - it is now the proven solution.

K2m · Post by **K2m** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 1:11 am

I put a sprung centered, brass button clutch plate in the standard clutch. No slip what so ever. This is between a EJ 20 @ 15 psi, and a liberty DR box with "L" Low range.

Ran it for 6 years before recently replacing the whole clutch.

89 Touring wagon. One owner.... Me:-D

Phizinza · Post by **Phizinza** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:10 am

In my Brumby I ran EJ22 with half an Liberty gearbox giving me the Liberty clutch. Offroad it slipped a little more then I liked. When I had the Liberty friction plate next to the L series one they were identical. So people are saying the fingers on the pressure plate are different rating?
I know of at least 4 people in the US running with EJ22's and standard EA82 clutches that have no complained.

Subafury · Post by **Subafury** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 10:38 am

nice to know that info andrew cheers.

liberty clutch is the same dimensions as L series one yes, i dont know about the pressures. i know when alex put his stocko clutch in - non beefed it flogged out after the first 2 trips it did in the sand and consequently had to be towed home from lancelin.

AndrewT · Post by **AndrewT** » Thu Apr 03, 2008 1:17 pm

Yeah friction plates are the same, the pressure plate is different - more powerful engine, more clamping pressure required.