customers/work

AlpineRaven · Post by **AlpineRaven** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 6:46 am

Since Ive resigned from my previous job (kind of got the sack).
My boss found out that I was working for myself (my own business which is registered) behind his back -> Really he didnt want to know what Im doing after hours so thats fine I dont need to tell him. He said when i first started, He said "You can do whatever you want after hours, but dont work in my own hours" So that was fine.
I asked for a payraise earlier this year & about 2 months ago - both declined, so I went out to find more customers for myself. A lot of them are word of mouth and they've come to me, even my ex boss's customers that I'm working for myself has contacted me.
When I resigned yesterday he said "Do not go around and taking my customers from me otherwise I'll sue you and you better get a very good lawyer"
He is bluffing, really since I am not working for him so I can do whatever I want to, I can go anywhere I want. I can get my own suppliers to be in business with.

Is that right - he is bluffing about it? (I could tell, he is shitting himself knowing that I've been successful?)
The biggest problem is, If I go somewhere and I don't know them that he knows that he is their customer how am I meant to know - still its a free country!
I'm thinking about calling my lawyer today for an advice.

Cheers
AP

Suby Roo · Post by **Suby Roo** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:23 am

I would probably talk to your lawyer, but i cant see it working against you, unless the customers have an exclusive contract but if they decide to change, its their choice, not your problem!

AlpineRaven · Post by **AlpineRaven** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:25 am

Suby Roo wrote:I would probably talk to your lawyer, but i cant see it working against you, unless the customers have an exclusive contract but if they decide to change, its their choice, not your problem!

Thats right its their choice to contact me or him.

In next few days I am planning to go around north and west suburbs giving out business cards to them and its their choice to come to me or not.
Cheers
AP

81GGR · Post by **81GGR** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:07 pm

mate i would be very careful if the people you are marketing too are you previous employers customers and you got their details during the course of your employment. customer lists etc. are confidential information and he may have rights against you for using that confidential information ourside of your employment with him, and especially if you are marketing to/soliciting work from that information.

the best thing you could do to help your cause is put an ad in local papers etc that circulate generally in the area of the places you are trying to market to, get a website etc. that way if your old boss does decide to go and see dennis denuto you will at least have some evidence that you have marketed generally and that is how people got in touch with you.

also, if you have a written employment agreement with him, check for any restraint of trade and confidential information clauses which might apply to you - even in the absense of such a clause there are common law duties imposed on you that you should be cautious of.

even where his customers contact you (ie: there is no direct marketing to them), you could be on the hook for breaching your oblgiations to your former employer in certain circumstances - so just be careful as you grow your new business.

AndrewT · Post by **AndrewT** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:38 pm

81GGR wrote:that way if your old boss does decide to go and see dennis denuto

lol

"it's just the whole vibe of the thing"

Subyroo · Post by **Subyroo** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 2:07 pm

81GGR wrote:mate i would be very careful if the people you are marketing too are you previous employers customers and you got their details during the course of your employment. customer lists etc. are confidential information and he may have rights against you for using that confidential information ourside of your employment with him, and especially if you are marketing to/soliciting work from that information.

the best thing you could do to help your cause is put an ad in local papers etc that circulate generally in the area of the places you are trying to market to, get a website etc. that way if your old boss does decide to go and see dennis denuto you will at least have some evidence that you have marketed generally and that is how people got in touch with you.

also, if you have a written employment agreement with him, check for any restraint of trade and confidential information clauses which might apply to you - even in the absense of such a clause there are common law duties imposed on you that you should be cautious of.

even where his customers contact you (ie: there is no direct marketing to them), you could be on the hook for breaching your oblgiations to your former employer in certain circumstances - so just be careful as you grow your new business.

+1 there 81GGR

Go and speak to your Lawyer he should be able to set you right as to what you can and can't do or put in touch with a Lawyer who can.

chubby37 · Post by **chubby37** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 4:38 pm

its called competition and thats what he will be scared of...81GGR is very right about contacts you made during your employment.if your old boss can prove you went to them he has you..as long as they contact you and you have not chased hios customersw your ok and as long as you dont make something he is making to the point were it can be shown to be a stolen idea your fine.it an open market but there are rule to play by.

gtcompletepower · Post by **gtcompletepower** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:44 pm

seek legal advice from legal aid its free then seek legal advice that costs money as he can sue you, even if he is bluffing he can probably afford legal stuff even if its just a letter to scare you off that will cost. dont chance it as he has every legal right to take action against you if he thinks you are taking (his) earnings from him. he doesnt have to be right he only has to think it

AlpineRaven · Post by **AlpineRaven** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:55 pm

Yep just visited my lawyer, He gave me an advice... "don't worry, there is no written down or any type of contract, verbal "contract" is nothing as there is nothing to prove of" then legally I can do whatever I can do. He has recorded the details so Its all good.

Another thing I found out today, He contacted the suppliers and as advised me to "stay away and don't deal with him" which is me, how dare he! I was pissed off but they said to me, not to worry as he does not have the right.

Also I found out, I've been unfair dismissal (because he forced me to resign) and he already paid me for 3 weeks holiday pay, nothing else, I am short of 2 weeks pay as "pay out" and by the law, he has to pay me 2 weeks advance to encourage me to find another job, also he has to pay me long service leave. So I've contacted wageline and they have recorded details but have to wait for a week as I'm waiting for some letters from my ex boss.. From there I will call them again to follow up.

Cheers
AP

subybrumby · Post by **subybrumby** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 9:08 pm

What sort of work do you do??

I know that as a musician, if I am hired as a guitar/ vocal/soloist by an agent to do a job at a pub somewhere, and in the contract the agent is collecting a fee, then if I were to do other work at that pub and try to cut the agent out, he can go me for any work I get there. Because he has introduced me to the venue. Does that make sense???

Anyway, you have good legal advice from a solicitor and that is the way to go. Best of luck with your business.

AlpineRaven · Post by **AlpineRaven** » Fri Nov 27, 2009 9:26 pm

subybrumby wrote:What sort of work do you do??

I know that as a musician, if I am hired as a guitar/ vocal/soloist by an agent to do a job at a pub somewhere, and in the contract the agent is collecting a fee, then if I were to do other work at that pub and try to cut the agent out, he can go me for any work I get there. Because he has introduced me to the venue. Does that make sense???

Anyway, you have good legal advice from a solicitor and that is the way to go. Best of luck with your business.

Thanks mate...

Service Technician specialising in woodworking machinery such as EdgeBanders, Panel Saws, Bandsaws, wall saws, so on... and also have been trained for ISO9000 in safety of operation.
Cheers
AP

thatsgoodsquishy · Post by **thatsgoodsquishy** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:25 am

I had a mate in a similar situation. Basically there are two major companies in the field he works in and he was working in sales for one of them. This means he knew EVERYTHING about the pricing/supply/profit/customer base of the company. Hated it so he jumped ship to the other company in the field without telling the first company where he was going.
I said to him at the time they wouldnt be happy and when they found out they went right off about it (which in this case i could understand, it would be like ford knowing every detail about holdens plans and costs for the present and future.) Turned out his contract had a clause preventing him from working in the same field or for a competitor for a period of time.
Anyway, long story short, he got legal advice and the clause was legal but the contract had a heap of other dodgy stuff in it. His lawyer wrote to original company pointing this out and he hasn't heard a thing since.
Upshot? I think you will be fine, especially if he is not paying you out what he should and there was no clause in your orig contract.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 2:39 am

It is all down to look after your staff or maybe they will just go to the competition and do even better with their own intellectual property.

I think the only laws around protect a buyer of a business from the seller starting up same business within a certain radius - must be what the old boss had in mind and your old boss might need a letter from your solicitor reminding him to keep his new views of his recently valued and respected employee to himself or legal action may be taken and you are aware of who and what he has already said

spike · Post by **spike** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 10:17 am

just watch your self for industrail espionage or whatever. when my dad left the defence fforce to start his own machine shop they dumped a lot of stuff on him about it because of such sensitive work. i cant imagine yours is the same sorrt of thing but yeah. as long as you get in touch with customers you knew and not through their files yo should be fine.

steptoe · Post by **steptoe** » Sat Nov 28, 2009 12:11 pm

make yourself known to everyone possible that may require your services, including council workshops, sheltered workshops so that you have not just gone to all of his customers only and keep an appointment diary showing who you have been to see with name and contact so you can demonstrate it in writing. Expand the machines and brands you can service.

I know a guy in a very specialised field whose son quit his Hitler style employ and Casanova character ( bit sick watchin' dirty old dad working on the short term employed office girls) , he went elsewhere for a few weeks then off to the only competitor in a very big region. After the whole industry knew and loved it , did dad find out. They just not talking anymore. Son loves hs new workplace. Confidentiality clauses were in place but not necessarily easy to prove any wrong doing happened.

rob83ke70 · Post by **rob83ke70** » Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:40 pm

Good luck with what you are doing!

In my trade, I'm told that there are a LOT of customers that follow the mechanic, not the business.... you will probably find a lot of customers if they aren't happy with your old business or were very happy with your work, they will follow you anyway...

Robert.