Help: Timing Belt

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:58 pm

So I've replaced the water pump and now I'm stuck trying to get the timing belt back on.

There must be a easy way of doing this but buggered if I can work it out.

One problem I have is when I align the timing marks on the left camshaft sprockets there is a fair amount of back-pressure and any slight movement they spin out of alignment (taking a nice gouge out of my finger the first time it happened

)

Will removing the spark plugs release this pressure?

The other advice I could do with is what order to do the belt in.

Here's a pic

I start with the tensioner and idler pulleys removed and the tensioner pulley at it's loosest setting.

Then I thread the timing belt across the top starting with the crankshaft sprocket (1), then over the left upper camshaft sprocket (2), and then the right hand upper camshaft sprocket (3).

I then install the upper idler pulley (4) and roll the tensioner pulley over to put some tension on the belt which seems to help keep things in place while I then try (with some difficulty) to get the belt around under the left lower camshaft sprocket (5), thru between the water pump and idler sprocket (6) then under the lower right hand camshaft sprocket (7).

At this point things seem pretty good. Then I try to install the lower idler pulley 8 and as I put tension on the belt the tensioner pulley rotates releasing tension on the belt and the left hand camshaft sprockets spring out of place and screw it all up and I'm back to square one.

Help!

Outback bloke · Post by **Outback bloke** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:34 pm

Where do you live? State/Suburb will do. Best bet is for some one on here to show you.

You can get a Gregories workshop manual and do it as it says.

Also, when you are putting the belt on, once you know the marks line up with the cam gear, you can turn the cam gear to keep the pressure. JUst as long as it doen't jump a tooth.

madmat · Post by **madmat** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:55 pm

I have an E manual that will help its for a 99 modle enging but i believe i will work for you. if you send me an email address i will send it to you. I would put it on here but don't know how to.

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 6:32 pm

agent.davidson[at]channelzero.co.nz

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 6:44 pm

My Gregories manual shows an engine with just 2 camshaft sprockets instead of 4, which threw me a little. Having 4 definately makes it more difficult.

It says the installation is pretty much the reverse of the removal, except I have to prepare the tensioner in a press (seems a vice would to the same thing) and put a pin into the locking holes.

Will removing the plugs help? It seems I get pretty close but come unstuck mainly cause of the pressure on the left hand camshaft sprockets.

I'm in Wellington, NZ so a visit from a member is probably off the cards.

dirty skirt · Post by **dirty skirt** » Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:21 pm

easiest way is to have a second person with you to hold spanners on two pullies (ie right side ones)and you on the left, if its a new belt i would loosen idler pullies 6 and 8 so you can have a bit more play on the bottom for the belt to go over pulley 8 cause its really tight,if you dont have a second person to help you you can use a screwdriver to lock the pulleys from moving,when the belts on wind the motor over by hand twice and recheck the timing marks because they can be a pain and be half a tooth out and you dont want that
hope this helps cheers steve

Matatak · Post by **Matatak** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 12:19 am

the fun of Cams.

and no u cant take plugs out and stop it.

do liek other people say have others hold the pulleys on correct marks while u put the belt on.

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 8:40 am

Thanks for the advice chaps. I also found this doc on the Internet which has a diagram which lists the number of teeth between timing marks which although must be from a more modern engine it seems identical to my EJ20.

http://agentdavidson.ddns.net/STi_PERFO ... G_BELT.pdf

Here is the diagram

So armed with this and your advice I'm pretty confident I won't end up towing it to Subaru to get it put back together

Cheers

Outback bloke · Post by **Outback bloke** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:28 am

Make sure you use the notch on the tang that sticks out at the rear on the crank gear. DO NOT use the arrow or any marks on the front of it.

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:45 am

Here is the E Manual madmat (thanks!) sent to me via email which covers the same stuff but is better quality

http://agentdavidson.ddns.net/MSA5TCD99L52.pdf

BYB-01 - I *think* I know what you mean?! Crank gear = A in the picture above right?

fredsub · Post by **fredsub** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 11:20 am

this thread rocs:p i'm sure i'll be needing it some time....

what size is the crankshaft socket on EJ? 22mm ?

the belt tensioner bit worries me,

Do not use a lateral type vise.

so how bad could it be really?

tis all more complicated than the ole ea82:(

madmat · Post by **madmat** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 11:31 am

I used a really big pair of multygrips to compress my tensioner and don't do it in a vise it must be done vertically so the oil inside can flow correctly without blowing seals. also don't force it to hard because that can blow the seals. and also don't piss on it because then it will stink.LOL You can trown it across the shop if need be just watch were it lands so you can find it when you calm down.LOL

Rob_D · Post by **Rob_D** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:23 pm

I've just read on another forum (non Subaru) a tip to use cable ties to hold the timing belt in place when fitting it.

Makes a lot of sense to me.

Rob

madmat · Post by **madmat** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:33 pm

another way to stop the gears from moving is to get a small bolt(maybe 6mm) with 2 large flat washers and a nut. when the gears are in the correct place place one washer on the head of the bolt and between the 2 gears (the bolt will go between the two gears). then on the other side of the gears put the other washer and nut (the washers should be engaging the teeth on the gears). what you should have made then is a clamp between the 2 gears that can hold them in place while you set the timing belt.

I think this reads ok if not harass me for something better.

matdav · Post by **matdav** » Sat Jan 26, 2008 7:00 am

Righto, she's all back together and running. No water leak anymore so its mission accomplished. Got my wife to hold the left exhaust cam in place with a breaker bar. Threading the timing belt was kinda easy in the end.

Only thing is I have a little bit of squeaking on startup from either the A/C belt or Alternator belt.

Does that mean it's too tight or too loose?

Subafury · Post by **Subafury** » Sat Jan 26, 2008 9:41 am

coincidently ive been doing the same mission on my L series- changing over the water pump. what a bitch of a job. i didnt think id moved the cam sprockets first time around when i had to loosen the belt, so did it all back up and then car wouldnt start. so yesterday took it all back out and followed the book on how to do it, except i lined everything up with the wrong marks on the flywheel! finally did it with the help of dad because i cbf doin it again on my own and she started up good

first time id driven the sl*t in 2 weeks, i was having withdrawal symptoms.
i also have belt slippage issues but have to take thermos off to tighten

more annoying stuff.
on a side note im a little worried about the tightness of the crank pulley bolt- how do i know if it is working its way loose? more belt slippage?

madmat · Post by **madmat** » Sat Jan 26, 2008 9:53 am

The crankshaft pully bolt should be tightened to 177NM or 130Foot pounds using a tourqu wrench. if you don't have a tourqe wrench then do it up fairly tight with a breaker bar. NOT as tight as you can.

if the pully is loose the belts won't slip but the pully will wobble around until it falls off.

if the belts are making a noise tighten them up.

aussie_guy00000 · Post by **aussie_guy00000** » Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:01 am

Subafury wrote: i didnt think id moved the cam sprockets first time around when i had to loosen the belt, so did it all back up and then car wouldnt start. so yesterday took it all back out and followed the book on how to do it, except i lined everything up with the wrong marks on the flywheel!

Umm, are you saying the engine wouldn't start because it wouldn't rotate when you got it all back together??? You do realise that if you've got the timing marks mixed up and the engine wouldn't rotate, it's because your valves are hitting your pistons or each other!!! I guess if it's running alright now (no strange noises or loss of power), then you didn't do any major damage, but that could've been nasty

.

Subafury · Post by **Subafury** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:30 am

yes well at the time i thought i had it spot on. very luckily it hasnt caused any damge- apparently the ea's are a non interferece engine to quote andrew which is a good thing haha. she's running sweet now

AndrewT · Post by **AndrewT** » Sun Jan 27, 2008 1:43 pm

I have a big torque wrench if u need to check that bolt matt

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Help: Timing Belt

Help - Timing Belt