EOI -> Custom 'L' Sreies front control arms

Xtreme_RX · Post by **Xtreme_RX** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 7:54 am

I am after any interest in custom chrome molly lower control arm for the 'L' series.

They will replace the original arm & radius rod.

They will be fully adjustable -> Camber & caster.

Price is still up in the air at the moment due to i have no idea how many I need to make..

There will be 2 versions. One for off road applications & one for std / lowered applications.

P.S. They will be ADR compliant & you will be able to choose between a 'L' seres ball joint end or a Liberty sized one...

AndrewT · Post by **AndrewT** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:52 am

Sounds interesting, I would be interested with a major deciding factor being price. Do you have any design diagrams we could sneak a peak at?

Venom · Post by **Venom** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 9:00 am

What would the difference be between the std and off-road version?

Xtreme_RX · Post by **Xtreme_RX** » Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:02 am

The off road version will have more lower offset & will run a different rear mount on the radius rod. (like a landcruiser coil front )

Cad drawings to follow......

brumbyrunner · Post by **brumbyrunner** » Thu Apr 16, 2009 11:30 pm

It's about time....

twilightprotege · Post by **twilightprotege** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:03 pm

wouldnt adjustable strut tops be a cheaper way to get correct camber? I was thinking of getting some made up. they are pretty easy to make

discopotato03 · Post by **discopotato03** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:59 pm

Yes I am interested but there are a few issues to be discussed .

Firstly where the length of the control arm is adjustable .
Secondly how the radius (compression rod) connects to control arm
Thirdly , what to do about the plunge depth of the DOJ .

In a perfect world its always preferable to adjust camber/caster from the top of a McPherson strut , particularly a FWD one because the track stays virtually the same as does the drive shaft alignment .
The down side is living with spherical joints and potentially increased Noise Vibration Harshness (NVH) .

I can't vouch for the legality but if people are going to stay with L Series struts I think the strut hole in the strut foot realignment trick is the go .

Cheers A .

Actually one thought I had was cutting the outer ends off L series control arms (beyond the radius rod holes) and extending them slightly whilst moving the ball joint tapered hole forward of the center line of the arm . This would give less positive camber and more positive caster , maybe 10 and 10mm ?
I'm not sure how the uneven forces would affect the inner control arm bush but at least the radius rod would help to a degree to resist the twisting forces .

Ah also people need to be careful that they don't run out of tie rod end length on the tie rods . What this means is increasing the distance between the control arms pivot and ball joint hole center means increasing the effective length of the tie rods or you get massive toe in .

twilightprotege · Post by **twilightprotege** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:03 pm

i'm still totally in favour of adjustable strut tops - keeps everything the same (radius rods etc) and shortens the axles which is handy for power handling - and allows me to raise the front a little more than the 2" blocks that are currently in there (I was going to up the blocks to 3" for "free" lift). but you're right, pillowball mounts can be noisy, but i dont care - a good handling car etc is more important than noise.

twilightprotege · Post by **twilightprotege** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:07 pm

further to that, if anyone wants to give me a stuffed front strut top, i can pass it on to my mate who's made pillowball adjustable strut tops for 3 cars now and he can CAD them up and get some quotes etc...

Xtreme_RX · Post by **Xtreme_RX** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:12 pm

The main reason why I am going to make these arms for is I have had enough of replacing bent radius rods & having crappy caster with a 4" lift. - Rubbing tyres on the guards.

The standard radius rods are WAY to short for a '4wd' application.
I think brumbyrunner knows what I am on about.

I run adjustable strut tops now. Adjustable strut tops are good but this setup is way better & stronger.

These arms are not for everybody / all applications. The initial set up will be for offroad use but ADR compliant & the best bit is you can use the liberty hub assembly & have no need to lengthen the control arm.

twilightprotege · Post by **twilightprotege** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:38 pm

where do the radius rods bend? and how can longer control arms give you different radius rods? they should really stay on the same plane i would have thought?

Xtreme_RX · Post by **Xtreme_RX** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:09 pm

They bend almost anywhere. In reality they are crappy design.

The control arm is not going to be any longer than the factory item at zero adjustment. It will have about 10 to 15mm adjustment which should be enough to give a good negative camber.

The radius rod set up is totally different to the factory unit. It will not mount the same way there will be a new mounting plate. -> It’s the only way to get ADR compliance.

It will become clear when I have finished the CAD drawings & R&D.

brumbyrunner · Post by **brumbyrunner** » Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:29 pm

They bend in the middle. It's no cause for concern though, it's what they are designed to do. When the front wheel slams into something hard enough, the radius rod bends ans absorbs some of the impact. Next up is the lower control arm which has a weak point on the inner end just before the bush. It bends back, tearing the rubber strut top in half and folding the front tyre into the firewall. It's a brilliant system and pretty to watch. You can replace (or straighten) the bolt-on bits and you're ready to go again.

Of course once you change things to make it stronger.....

brumbyrunner · Post by **brumbyrunner** » Wed Apr 22, 2009 9:44 pm

Hey Simon, did I kill your thread or what?

Just for the record I think it's a great idea that is long overdue and would love to see how they work out. It's an unfortunate side effect of beefing up componants that you transfer the weakest link to somewhere else. It's all in the process of making things better.

I don't want any myself as the next improvement I make to the front suspension of my racecar is upper and lower control arms and coilovers similar to the rear. Front end will be nearly all tube frame before that can happen though.

guyph_01 · Post by **guyph_01** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 1:30 am

Im interested..., any news on the cad drawings and prices??

thx

discopotato03 · Post by **discopotato03** » Sun Jun 07, 2009 12:59 pm

Yes me too .

I get the feeling that not too much gets done with what Subaru call "the Leading Edge Bracket" in their factory WSM . BTW by this they mean the compression strut (radius rod) body mounting bracket .

The rubber bushes allow some movement but I guess if you raised one of these cars by a significant amount and left the body mount end of the radius rod in the std position the angularity would be beyond what the bushes would allow movement wise .
The other thing is that the anti climb/dive geometry would be altered so you can get unusual handling traits .

My RX had extra steel radius rod washers used to space the rods forward for extra positive caster - and Nissan urethane bushes used .
This does work but its killing the control arm inner bushings because they are out of alignment with the mounting bolts .
Also it was difficult to get the control arm/radius rod bolts back in because the angle between the rod and arm changes when you push the arms further forward . A bit of die grinding would have fixed that .

I think the bottom line is that the control arm angle has to be taken into account and the radius rods height taken into consideration when changing camber and caster .
If you can get enough travel into adjustable strut tops they are possibly the best way to go about it but to do it properly is most likely going to involve small diameter springs and seats so they miss the sides of a reasonably compact strut tower .

For camber alone re boring and sleeving the knuckle is a good way and it looks bog std unless you scrutinise the strut foot . It achieves the same thing as camber bolts on an Impreza or early Lib strut only non adjustable .
Strong enough for Rally use so the sane driver shouldn't have strength issues .

A .

YouTube · Post by **El_Freddo** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 11:32 am

I'm guessing this is now a dead thread?

I'm trawling for information on a replacement radius rod to push my front wheels forward to where they were factory - I think the lift kit has pulled the wheel centre further to the rear as I'm running a 3 inch kit with 2 inch radius rod plate lift, thus the radius rod needs to be longer to put the wheel back in its original position.

Any update would be great.

Cheers

Bennie

discopotato03 · Post by **discopotato03** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:39 am

I think it would be interesting trying to get ADR aproval on any non standard adjustable suspension component particularly when it involves significant raising and lowering of the ride height .

The problems are 1) OE strength/durability and 2 will it still fold up in the case of a severe enough front end shunt .

I think the chances would be better with non adjustable components ie made up new arms and rods but still the crash compliance .

Also no one has though of what to do when you fit longer control arms to correct the camber and find the drive shafts need lengthening too .

As I said elswhere contact Stewart Wilkins Motorsport and ask them to get longer rods made from 60 T steel .
XT6 front shafts longer than L but shorter than early Lib , unobtanium so early Lib shafts in the right splines it would have to be .

A .

spike · Post by **spike** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 6:54 am

discopotato03 wrote:XT6 front shafts longer than L but shorter than early Lib , unobtanium so early Lib shafts in the right splines it would have to be .

A .

where are they getting them in the states?
ill put a post on USMB and see what results we get

spike · Post by **spike** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:04 am

i have a set of XT6 drive shafts being offered to me if anyone is interested in the details. located in the states and the boots are on the way out but its the shafts you want i think the cvs would be the same as normal EAs

The AUSubaru.com.au Forums

EOI -> Custom 'L' Sreies front control arms

EOI -> Custom 'L' Series front control arms