Touring Wagon - Will not start

[RSR 555]

Sounds like it's time for an electronic dizzy - and from another post I've read previously tonight there's apparently one going cheap after the forum member purchased it from fleabay only to find he already had an electronic dizzy!

Like this one?

showthread.php?t=23269

[El_Freddo]

Like this one?

showthread.php?t=23269

Yup!

Bennie

[steptoe]

I always pulled the standard phillips screws out and flung them, in favour of allen screws.
Much less likely to drop into the guts of the dissy, and easier to tighten/undo.

M4 0.8mm pitch from deep memory - is typical of Hitachi dizzy in EA82's

[GunFactory]

So another issue.

First a quick disclaimer - which ties into the suggestions made previously

- I have not converted to electronic ignition (Feeling that way inclined however)
- I have replaced most of the consumable ignition system in the last 1500km (plugs, leads, distributor cap, rotor, points, coil)
- I have not replaced the condenser/voltage regulator/resistor can't remember what they are called (one on top of coil and one under the distributor)

[ATTACH]4087[/ATTACH]

Mounted on coil - Is this the resistor?

- I have not check the distributor shaft play
- I have not addressed the leak in the gaskets/seals on the carbie pictured earlier in the thread

Most of these suggestions came before this following issue



The car is presenting with a surging/missing symptom, usualy in lower RPM and engine load, although it's often very intermittent, has been to the mechanic and behaved beautifully without any hiccups twice now.

Since actually presenting the problem for us both - the mechanic called it out as an electrical issue.

The issue presented at idle as we fiddled with an old engine alarm and e leading us to think some poor/old wiring could be the cause.

[INDENT] I subsequently got the alarm and peripherals removed by an auto electrician who soldered everything back to a more original state. No change to problem.
[/INDENT]

[INDENT]Replaced coil - no change to problem - but car feels more responsive/a bit more go (could be a $25 placebo)[/INDENT]

following this car became almost un-drivable - missing and choking through all gears regardless of engine load - stalled a number of times as well.

[INDENT]Checked fuel filter - full of filthy sediment red in colour - changed fuel filter to a repco filter, drained fuel from carbie back.

[ATTACH]4085[/ATTACH]

Still running like crap - cloth over carbie trick with some fierce engine revs - runs beautifully for the rest of the day.[/INDENT]

That evening got a little wild with the carbie cleaner figuring my problem could be some kind of dirty carbie/crap in fuel issue (considering state of fuel filter) I didn't run the car for long after all this cabbie cleaner

the next morning the car wouldn't start - flooded pretty bad/wet plugs NRMA came and in the end - no spark/weak spark across the god damn points

[INDENT]Used a small file to clean them up a bit - there was some filth covering them by the looks - car cranks over and runs like there was never a damn issue![/INDENT]

Did 500km trip to Yadbro flat, Pigeon House mountain etc. The car continued to present the occasional intermittent stalling when coasting to a stop and surge/miss every now and then. Got outrageously sideways in some mud up there - grins all-round! and managed to impress my housemate who has a 2011 turbo diesel triton with the 4x4 ability of the tiny wagon. Great time.

[ATTACH]4088[/ATTACH]

As I reached the end of the tank in Ulladulla the same horrendous un-drivable condition emerged.

[INDENT]New tank of fuel and cloth overcarbie and it's back to normal - drove 150km back to Wollongong with the same occasional miss etc.[/INDENT]

I had a look inside the distributor yesterday and noted that what I assume is the positive wire -points + exiting the distributor (the other side appears to run from points to a ground screw inside the distributor) has a frayed crap insulating cloth, so much so that I can see the copper wire where it is screwed onto the points - this could be an issue but would require point removal to replace by the looks.

There are a couple of threads on the forum which appear to address similar issues - most notably, Silverbullets thread which features a cheeky problem which followed him across from one car to another - solved in the end with an electronic ignition

I cant really afford to buy my way through all of the suggestions noted above at the current time. So i guess I'm curious if anyone has any suggestions or insights based on my rambling story above.

Many thanks again,

Eli

[Silverbullet]

Sounds quite similar to my problem indeed, although yours seems to be more centered around the carbie. In the end I found my points distributor had an intermittent, internal short circuit which explains why it followed the engine through 2 cars. If you've got a multimeter with continuity it's easy to test; I think it's one probe on negative side of coil and other on a good ground? should beep for continuity depending on points open or closed, if beeping all the time its shorting out. Yes that white thing on the coil is the ballast resistor, and they don't go intermittent as far as I know. If they fail, they don't work at all.

As for you carbie problem, has it ever been rebuilt? Sounds like you must have some crap floating around in there blocking things up every now and then. I would suggest rebuilding it (easily done in a day, see my thread) or get it professionally rebuilt (costly) Another little issue I found after I rebuilt mine was I'd put the needle in wrong for the float chamber, it wasn't opening all the way and not letting enough fuel in which would cause it to stall and fart about up hills (what little fuel there was being pushed to the back)

[Subydoug]

Might have to pop out the fuel tank and make sure it aint rusted out. Rust in the filters can indicate that. Question, does the car stall for measurable durations, like 10s, or is it more like a savage miss? Does the engine sould lean at idle? Rich at idle? When the engine is running, if you get a hose and gently squirt water around the base of the carby and where the carby bolts to the manifold, it will stumble if there is a vac leak (only very little water is needed)


Yes the white thing on the coil is the ballast resistor. If your digital multimeter does capasity, make sure that the caps on the coil and at the distributor are ok. If they are damaged it can cause flakey spark from arking at the points. Also leads to premature failure of the points.

Regards

Doug

[steptoe]

Right back in archives you will find more than one has fixed a similar problem by removing all filters and pump from fuel lines and blow compresed air from front in engine bay to where fuel pump hooks up, then from fuel pump line to tank. Ensure tank is empty so you can pull sender off and scrape out the crud from rusty insides of fuel line

Think mine was sold due to previous owners attempts to pay qualifieds to sort it

Then I come along, plugs, leads coil, filters, carby kit, fuel pump then the resounding THOONK of crud landing on the floor of inside the tank

[GunFactory]

Thanks Silverbullet, Subydoug and Steptoe for your responses.

I have a few things to check out by the sounds!

If you've got a multimeter with continuity it's easy to test; I think it's one probe on negative side of coil and other on a good ground? should beep for continuity depending on points open or closed, if beeping all the time its shorting out. Yes that white thing on the coil is the ballast resistor, and they don't go intermittent as far as I know. If they fail, they don't work at all.

As for you carbie problem, has it ever been rebuilt? Sounds like you must have some crap floating around in there blocking things up every now and then. I would suggest rebuilding it (easily done in a day, see my thread)

I don't currently have a multimeter with continuity, good to know about the ballast resistor.

As far as I know the carbie has never been rebuilt! I did take a look at your thread, doesn't look as intimidating as I had thought. It might be time to buy a kit.

Might have to pop out the fuel tank and make sure it aint rusted out. Rust in the filters can indicate that. Question, does the car stall for measurable durations, like 10s, or is it more like a savage miss? Does the engine sould lean at idle? Rich at idle? When the engine is running, if you get a hose and gently squirt water around the base of the carby and where the carby bolts to the manifold, it will stumble if there is a vac leak (only very little water is needed)

I will have to give this spray test a go. If there is a noticeable stumble might follow Silverbullets rebuild advice.

The car often stalls as the idle just drops right off, but it can be restarted very easily in most cases. It can be prevented from stalling by keeping the revs up. (making me think not a spark issue here?)

Im not entirely sure what a lean or a rich sound is like to be honest! It Idles quite smoothly I think. The miss can vary but is often not reflected in the digidash RPM gauge, quite quick and distinct.

It feels different from when I have had to use the cloth over carbie technique.

Right back in archives you will find more than one has fixed a similar problem by removing all filters and pump from fuel lines and blow compresed air from front in engine bay to where fuel pump hooks up, then from fuel pump line to tank. Ensure tank is empty so you can pull sender off and scrape out the crud from rusty insides of fuel line

I am almost at the bottom of my tank and am seriously considering dropping the tank and attempting a blow out of the fuel lines. In the car Hanes manual I have, it suggest washing the tank out with water - Is it just a matter of ensuring that it is completely dry before reinstalling the tank?

Cheers,

Eli

[Silverbullet]

The car often stalls as the idle just drops right off, but it can be restarted very easily in most cases. It can be prevented from stalling by keeping the revs up. (making me think not a spark issue here?)

Ah now that sounds familiar; is this symptom worse on cold days? or worse when the engine is cold/warming up? I had a very similar issue with my engine before I rebuilt the carb on it. Also sometimes when warming up with the choke out, just sitting there the revs would slowly drop until it either stalls or you blip the throttle and it revs right up again to repeat the process until you drive off.

Dunno what was causing it, must have been something in the carb since I haven't had a hint of that issue since. Also if you go with the spray test on yours, see if you can reach and spray some water on the butterfly shafts; they run from where the throttle cable joins, through the carbie and the ends of the shafts sit in 2 holes on the other side. May not be visible when on the car since they're under the float bowl. Anyway the "bearing" holes for these shafts can wear, leaking air as well.

[GunFactory]

Hey so this week the car has not even suggested that there could be a problem plaguing it. Not a sign at all, no stall and no miss.

I have not noticed it so much with cold weather - definitely the slow stall and save with throttle blip.

Gave the carbie a quick spray test, no change in revs, however I'll do it again more throughly.

Something in the front resonator gave way though, sounded like lots of small rocks inside the extractors at certain RMP when driving a horrible noise which drew many odd looks. that hung around for a bit - you could hit the pipe hard with your hand and something would bounce about inside.

It's moved now - back to the second resonator or beyond. No noise now, except if you bang on the pipe with a tool.

[GunFactory]

A quick update,

The car has run like a dream for the last three weeks.

Tonight however with the fuel light on, I noticed something interesting.

When stopped and idling in neutral, the car was running smoothly. Put it in Drive or Reverse - again stationary - the cheeky missing would rear it's ugly head. Apply more revs while in gear (still stationary) and the miss would disappear. "

Could this point to partial obstruction of one of the holes in the carbie jets? The first for example (I've been told there are four) If so It could explain how with more revs/ the engine could get more fuel through the next hole and get around any blockage? Not sure if I'm on the right track here.

It's never been this 'on' or 'off' - Could there be any other link between engine under load/in gear and the miss?

Can I rule out electrics?

Currently thinking when I have time:

Tank out and clean + attempt to blow out the fuel lines from the front (providing I can access a compressor)

Coupled with a home job carby rebuild, following a youtube video and the link and write up curtesy of Silverbullet.

Cheers,

Eli

[steptoe]

Drive and reverse are putting the mildest load on the engine beyond neutral, the revs drop in these positions. What if when in neutral you reduce the revs at the throttle screw to see if the miss turbns up at these lower revs?